Fungi Dube

It was a real joy to connect with Fungi Dube for this week’s episode of the podcast. She’s a skilled brand, web, and Webflow designer in Harare, Zimbabwe, and I love how she leverages her culture in her designs to create stunning visual and digital experiences for clients around the world.

We covered a range of topics related to design and creativity. Fungi shared the importance of understanding a client’s needs and goals, spoke about the creative community in Zimbabwe, and talked about how she transitioned from being a trained scientist to a talented designer. If you’re looking to find inspiration from within, then this interview with Fungi will definitely bring it to you!

Interview Transcript

Maurice Cherry:
All right, so tell us who you are and what you do.

Fungi Dube:
I am Fungi Dube. I am a brand visual and Webflow web designer based in Harare, Zimbabwe. I have been designing, according to LinkedIn, for almost eight years now. So I think that’s super cool. And I mostly am inspired… not mostly, largely inspired by the profound nuances that are embedded in African culture. So if you are to interact with my work or engage with my work online, you’re probably going to see that a lot of it is really centered on African narratives and seeing how I can tell their stories in a really fresh and inspiring way.

Maurice Cherry:
So how has the year been going for you so far?

Fungi Dube:
The year has been good. I feel like at the very start of it, I was kind of flailing about, just trying to get everything in place and trying to organize myself personally, just getting my goals out there and that sort of thing. So it was a bit of a whirlwind, but as it has progressed, it’s gotten better. I feel like I am more in control. I’ve regained all balance and it’s been really good. I’ve been working on some super exciting projects that hopefully you’ll see the light of day soon. But yeah, so far so good.

Maurice Cherry:
Do you have any goals in particular that you want to accomplish for the year?

Fungi Dube:
Definitely, definitely. I have a lot of sort of business-centered goals when it comes to being a solopreneur and running my own design brand, but I also have goals with regards to sort of tapping more into the design education space and seeing what I can do with that. So I do have two big, major self-initiated projects that I’m working on that I’m also funding that I’m hoping are going to work, and then I can go and ask people for money to make them bigger. But yeah, I definitely have a few things that I’m working on at the moment that I would like to see done by the end of the year.

Maurice Cherry:
Oh, nice. I mean, I’d love to learn a little bit more about them, as much as you want to go into detail about them.

Fungi Dube:
I don’t want to keep it too generic, but pretty much the focus of these projects is that I feel that there’s a gap, and the gap is seen in how when it comes to African design systems or African design education or African inspiration in general when it comes to design is a little bit lacking. So you are able to find references and that sort of thing on Google. You could probably go outside and have a chat with a roadside vendor or with your grandmother and find out about things and that sort of thing, but I want to be able to at least contribute towards the documentation of some of these things. So there’s definitely a gap when it comes to the literature that we can read with regards to African narratives and how to implement them in design. So the project’s really one which is digital and one which is actually physical or centered on being able to start this documentation process, not only for designers now, but for designers to come.

Maurice Cherry:
That sounds really interesting. I’d love to hear more about that once it’s out in the world.

Fungi Dube:
Definitely. I’ll definitely let you in once there’s something to actually see.

Maurice Cherry:
Yeah. Now, you just earlier described yourself as a solopreneur. Tell me just kind of more in general about your design work and what you specialize in doing.

Fungi Dube:
I don’t know if I should take the audience all the way back, but initially when I did start designing, I sort of was everywhere. So you could have told me to do, I don’t know, to design a flyer for the most random thing ever and I would’ve done it because I was still learning and sort of getting my feet or dipping my toes in the water just to see what the industry was like. But I want to say probably at the four-year mark of my seven plus, almost eight year journey, it sort of clicked that I wanted to be able to work on projects that I could see myself in as a young Black, Zimbabwean female African designer.

So I made the shift and my focus since then has been seeing how I can leverage African culture, African narratives, nuances that are embedded in African cultures like textures, colors, patterns, the use of graphic symbols as a way of visual and global communication, and just seeing how I can interpret that in a fresh, modern, and inspired way and send that out to the world. So that is the base or the foundation of the work, and then the sort of disciplines that I work within would be the brand design space, the visual design space, and more recently the Webflow design space.

Maurice Cherry:
Yeah. I worked briefly, this was back from 2017 to 2020-ish, I worked for a company that was doing a lot of, not no code, low code, they really actually wanted to be more code, but we worked a lot with or kind of in congress with other companies that were doing those sort of similar things, like Webflow, basically taking the process of design and sort of democratizing it in a way where you could use a product to create things. I’ve used Webflow before. It’s super powerful. I love how you’re able to really create full, really fully functioning sites with just dragging and dropping. And if you want to get into the code you can, but I like that the code is not a hindrance in order for you to create something.

Fungi Dube:
Yeah, it’s really changed my perspective on design as well, because there’s just so much that you can do. So Webflow is super flexible, infinite possibilities when it comes to very unique user experiences and customizing really cool interfaces and animations and interactions. So yeah, it’s been a really cool journey so far. This would be my second year in Webflow, but I’m just super excited to really learn more about it and see what I can create with it.

Maurice Cherry:
So what does a typical day look like for you?

Fungi Dube:
Goodness. Okay. So my routine has changed a little bit as the start of this year, but I used to be 5:00 AM club. I am not anymore. I have become 7:00 or 8:00 AM club, and that’s perfectly fine. So that’s the time that I usually wake up. I tend to have my little morning routine, so whether that’s cleaning my space, making my bed, taking a shower, having some breakfast, but I will be settled at my desk around 9:00 in the morning. I like to get administrative tasks out of the way first, so I check my emails, I check my socials. I am also a brand design coach with Flux Academy, so I tend to check all of those emails as well and see what’s happening in the community with the students. And then right after that, which is probably maybe an hour, an hour and a half, then I’ll dive into any kind work that I could be working on.

So I tend to also like to work in little sprints throughout the day. So I’ll dedicate an hour block or an hour and a half block to a certain task, and then I’ll move on to the next one. But with each and every single day, I do at least make sure that I prioritize time to go to the gym. So that’s usually in the late afternoon. And if I am able to, I also schedule nap and nap time because I think it’s important to recharge and occasional dance breaks. It’s so weird, but I have it in my schedule to be like, “Okay, I think that we need to just blast some tunes right now and just have a vibe at the desk,” so that things don’t get too hectic and you don’t feel like you’re losing your mind. So yeah, that’s pretty much what a typical day looks like for me. In the evenings after gym, dinner, shower, cup of tea, I’ll wind down and maybe watch something on Netflix, read something before I go to bed, and we start it all over again. But my workday is usually done around 10:00 PM in the evening.

Maurice Cherry:
I love that you have these breaks in the day scheduled for play, or I would say for non-work, but you’ve got them scheduled in your calendar and you don’t move them around or anything. I love that.

Fungi Dube:
Yeah, I think it’s super important to prioritize things such as help us to also relax as designers, because I think it’s super easy for us to be at our desks plugged behind our computer screens for 16 hours a day and you actually don’t realize that you’ve been working for so long. So I’m a strong advocate for making sure that… and balance looks different for everyone, I should add that, but just for ensuring that at least there’s a little bit of me time even in the chaos and the busyness of work. So even if it’s 20 minutes of just, “Hey, let’s do some chair dancing, or let’s take a quick nap,” I’m definitely going to take it for sure.

Maurice Cherry:
And I think it’s super important, especially when you’re a solopreneur, because nobody’s going to prompt you to do that. Nobody’s going to tell you, “Hey, maybe you should take a break.” You have to do it. You have to schedule it in in order to make sure that you get that done.

Fungi Dube:
Yeah. And that’s the thing as well. When you’re a solopreneur, you have to wear many hats. So it can get really overwhelming and you find yourself sort of feeling a lot more burnt out and that sort of thing. So I had to be very intentional about ensuring that I scheduled this into my day-to-day so that at least I can cope with everything else that I have to do, because I have to be social media manager, I have to be accountant, I have to be administrator, designer, strategist, all in one. So just having that time to yourself where you can just do nothing or where you can play really, really, really makes a difference.

Maurice Cherry:
Yeah. So let’s say you’re starting a new project. It can be from a new client, from a current client. What does your creative process look like?

Fungi Dube:
From the jump, I like to have a discovery call. With any potential leads, I will write to them and just find out when they’re available for us to meet. I will introduce myself in this call. I will also listen to them talk about their brand/their business, their service, their product, what it is that they think they need for their brand, because sometimes you will actually find out that they may think that they need branding, but maybe they actually need a strategy first and that sort of thing. So once we’ve had that discovery call, then I follow that up with documentation and what this documentation is, depending on what sort of service they’re after. So whether it’s brand design, whether it’s web design, I’m just going to send them a questionnaire where they can then put all the words that we discussed in the call onto paper just as a form of reference for the both of us so that if I need to pick up any vital information and that sort of thing, then I know that I can always refer back to that document.

It also helps me to set a project proposal, which covers all of our working terms. So issues to deal with costing, with deliverables, with turnover times, just for general terms of engagement that allow for us to be happy as you go throughout, as we work on the project and that sort of thing. And then once that’s signed, sealed and delivered, then I will then start working on the project. So it’s very collaborative on my end, where I tend to also include and involve my clients in the project as much as possible. And so I set up a central workspace on Notion where we can exchange ideas, where we can shorten the feedback loop, where everyone has access to everything. So at any stage of the project they can see exactly what’s going on, they can see what assets are being created and that sort of thing.

So when it actually comes to the design process of it, I’m going to start off with the visual mood boarding phase, which is basically putting together or curating some reference images that capture the essence of the brand or how we are trying to get it to look like. Once that’s approved, then I go into development, which will obviously be very different depending on what the project is. So it could be the logo suite and then colors type, supporting assets like iconography, brand patterns, maybe illustrations to accompany some of the assets that have been created and that sort of thing. And then, I will iterate on that of which in my project proposal I also stipulate how many rounds of revision are allowed for the project depending on the price and everything.

And then once it’s happiness and joy, we’ve sort of worked through it, we’ve edited what needs to be edited, we’ve revised what needs to be revised, then I will hand over all the asset files to them, inclusive of all the high resolution formats, inclusive of the original source files, and obviously guidelines and that sort of thing as to how they should retain the integrity of the brand identity that we have just worked on together. And yeah, that’s it. So that’s sort of how I cycle through it, but it’s all also very, very, very, very heavily based on research. I think that probably takes me 80% of the time and then executing everything is like 20% of the time, because I want to make sure that I am obviously creating something that is distinct, something that’s memorable, something that’s competitive, but something that also captures the heart and the essence of their story. So yeah.

Maurice Cherry:
Do you find that clients often want skip that research step and they just want to go right into the creation part?

Fungi Dube:
I have had instances where that has happened, but it hasn’t been that often in the recent years. But if that has been the case, that’s been an immediate red flag because I think the discovery call has helped me to get a sense of whether they would be open to my process or not. So if we are on the call and they’re like, “Hey, you know what? Let’s just skip over that. Don’t really matter. Let’s just design the logo and let’s go,” then I know almost immediately that that’s not going to work because there’s a lot more work that goes into the visuals or into the final outcome that people are then going to engage with. So it does happen. It has happened. It doesn’t happen as often now, but I mean, we are dealing with people at the end of the day, so everyone has a different way of thinking of how things should be done, so there’s that.

Maurice Cherry:
Yeah. I’ve often found even when clients want to skip that step, it always extends the project because what ends up happening is you’re making something, you’re just jumping right into it, and then you have to do X number rounds of revisions, which I like that you put in, you stipulate, “I’m only doing this many revisions.” The research helps so you stick to that, so you’re not kind of doing this constantly iterating process of trying to appease the client without doing the research first so you can try to get it right the first two or three times as opposed to, “Here’s version 12 of what we’ve been working on.” No one has time for that.

Fungi Dube:
Yeah, no one has time for that for sure. And what I actually wanted to add on to that is to say that when you find that you have clients who sort of jump the gun in that way or want to do that, it really takes away from the process in the sense that you’re saying you definitely will find yourself maybe having to go back to V1 or after you are at V7 of the project, and it’s really not going to benefit you and it’s not going to benefit them either, because I think there’s going to be a lot of frustration there.

Research really, really, really helps you to get to that point where also you are not designing according to your client’s preference, which is another thing that we need to mention, because they are going to have their personal taste and everything like that, which is fair and fine, and we should definitely consider that, but we need to understand that when it comes to these sort of branding and visual projects, we’re also designing together or to appeal towards a certain target market or audience. So that research is essential. It really ensures that, “Hey, when we push this out, are we going to be speaking to the right people and then are they going to take it the way that we intend for them to do so?” So if anyone is listening, and if your client or potential lead is like, “No, no, no, we are not going to do research. We are just going to skip through this,” then I will tell you to not take that project. It’s not going to be worth your peace of mind.

Maurice Cherry:
Yeah. What are the best types of clients for you to work with?

Fungi Dube:
So I have had a broad range of individuals and small businesses and corporates that I’ve worked with, and I can’t even pin it down to who the best kind of client is because I think everyone comes with a different kind of energy and a different kind of vibe. But what I’ll say is that in general, some of the projects that I’ve really enjoyed working on with individuals or small businesses, startups, enterprises who really value the importance of storytelling in one way or another.

So if we’re on the call and off the bat they’re like, “Oh, we started this in 1897 and it was because my grandmother did this and did that,” and you just get this wholesome story that they just tie together and they tell you the background of why they’re doing it and that sort of thing, immediately I get good vibes from that because I’m like, “Oh, this is going to be something good to work on because there’s a lot more meaning and there’s that strong emotional connection to what they’re doing as opposed to just selling a product.” So those have been that clash of individuals who come with that sort of energy and that value storytelling in one form or another have been some of the best project that I’ve worked on.

Maurice Cherry:
Now you’re in Harare, Zimbabwe. I’d love for you to just paint a picture for the audience. I would say our audience is probably largely in the US. What does the creative industry look like there? Is it centered around Harare? Just kind of give us a window into what the industry is like there.

Fungi Dube:
So I would say that it is. We do have another major city called Bulawayo. Harare is the capitol, and a lot of what happens on the creative scene definitely happens here. And what’s really exciting about this time that we’re in is that we’re in a season where the creative scene in Harare or in Zimbabwe in general is on the rise. So even when it comes to novel ways of expressing fashion, of expressing fine art, of expressing expressive photography, there have been some really cool live exhibitions that have happened. They’ve been very urban fashion and photography exhibitions and shows that have also happened in the most unlikely places as well, where you would see these sort of things. And it’s just been really exciting seeing how young Zimbabwean creators are really stepping up or really stepping into their own, are really honing their craft and are really thinking of new ways of expressing the ideas. So it’s on the rise. It’s on the rise. I’m hoping that it infiltrates and sort of starts to penetrate crowd supporters overseas, but there’s a lot, a lot, a lot of exciting things that are happening currently.

Maurice Cherry:
Have you been able to tap into a creative community where you’re at?

Fungi Dube:
So I am a part of creative communities, not just here alone. I think if anything, when it comes to more of the work that I do with regards to branding web, there’s definitely room for there to be something that sort of unites creatives who do the same thing that I do. But that is, it’s there, but it’s not there. I know that’s very vague, but it makes so much sense in my head. I think there’s definitely room to see where that can go and what can be done with regards to that, but in terms of just general design communities and stuff like that, I am a part of and have had the wonderful opportunities to connect with other African creatives on the continent who are based in different cities to me. So that’s something that I’ve been able to do.

Maurice Cherry:
Well, I think if the creative scene is on the rise, like you mentioned it, it kind of I guess would make sense that there’s maybe not a lot of creative groups yet because things are still, it’s in that sort of burgeoning state where stuff’s beginning, stuff’s starting to pop off, stuff is starting to gain attention and gaining traction. So it’s probably just the visibility thing I would imagine at this point because yeah, I think it might just be a visibility thing. I’m completely guessing. I have no idea what it’s like in Zimbabwe, but I just know usually when I’ve talked with other people in other cities all across the world, when they’ve had those sort of small design spaces or creative spaces that are starting to pop up, the community just hasn’t coalesced yet around something. So I think as the scene rises, those types of things will happen. I think you’ll be able to find some community there, but it’s good, like you said, that you’ve been able to find it elsewhere, too.

Fungi Dube:
And I agree with you. I think it’s definitely a visibility thing for sure, but it’s something that we’re slowly breaking into. But yeah, everything in strides, I would say.

Maurice Cherry:
Yeah. Well, let’s learn more about you as a person. I know you kind of gave us a hint into your kind of daily creative routine, but I’d love to hear more about you growing up. Were you really into design and art as a kid? Tell me more about that.

Fungi Dube:
So I always enjoy talking about my childhood. It’s a very special, special time for me. I grew up with what I would say were liberal parents in the sense that they let me explore. So both my parents were vet surgeons and we lived in a very small town here in Zimbabwe called Norton. It’s very nice, it’s very peaceful there. So I say liberal in the sense that whenever my parents went out on site visits, whether it was to farms for vaccinations and that sort of thing, they sort of let me wonder often see what I could find. I don’t know if that’s dangerous or not, but they kind of let me do it, to the point that on one of my site visits with my dad, I sort of snuck into an ostrich pen and I saw a massive ostrich egg, and I surprised my dad when he got home and he was like, “What is that? When did that happen?” I was like, “well, listen, you kind of let me wander off, so that’s what happened.”

But I do find that even from that, it really sort of opened up my mind in terms of how I thought and what I did. So I spent a lot of time outside. I built a lot of sandcastles, I played with dirt, I built things with sticks. So because of that, even when I then started going to primary school, I’m not sure what you would call it, but when you’re maybe six years old and you start going off to school, so we call it primary school, I found myself also taking time out to make special DIY cards for my family members at that young age for special occasions. So if my aunt had a birthday, if my cousin had a birthday, I would draw my favorite cartoon characters on the front of the card, just a blank sheet of paper, fold it in half, draw my favorite characters, color them in and give that to them as a birthday card.

So I think the creative sort of inclinations and the creative bone or creative DNA has been there from the time that I was born really, but I didn’t know that I could actually sort of capitalize on it or I could really bring it in and do something with it, which is why, like you mentioned earlier, as you were talking before this, that I went on to study science instead of anything creative. So instead of anything design related. I think maybe it probably worked as well because my parents essentially would’ve been in the scientific field because of the veterinary surgery and all of that. So it made sense for me to also do something in line with that or try and go into the scientific field.

But yeah, I kind of realized it much later after I graduated. I was like, “Wait, okay. There’s this thing called design and I could probably take it up and let’s see where it goes.” But again, I wouldn’t say that it’s something that I really thought of. It happened also in a very freakish way because after I graduated from university in 2014, I was job hunting for six months at the start of 2015, and I couldn’t find anything anywhere. I put my CV in the most random corners of the world and nothing came up, and I was so frustrated and I had no idea what I was going to do.

So in order to curb my frustration, I decided that I needed to teach myself a new skill. But even how design came about, again, maybe it’s divine order, maybe it’s something in the universe, I don’t know what it is. I was on YouTube and my top recommended video was a Photoshop tutorial. And it’s so weird, Maurice, because I had never heard of Photoshop before and I had never remotely… you could be like maybe the algorithm was doing things or whatever, but I had not even searched anything that is even closely linked to anything to do with Photoshop. So it was so weird. I just kind of clicked into it and my mind was blown because I was like, “Wait, are you telling me that people can actually do this with your computers and people make money from this and it’s a whole thing that you can do?” It was so bizarre to me.

So that’s how it sort of started, and I started self-learning in design, and I also happened to get a full-time job that I started going to towards the middle of May in education. So I worked in education for six years with children age between 6 and 12 years old, and I was in the sports and coaching and conditioning department at the school, so in line more with the human physiology part of what I studied, but I was learning design on the side. I would go to work and come back and be like, “Wait, what can I learn today? Let me pull up another YouTube tutorial.” And at the time, I had a jet engine of a laptop and I had cracked Photoshop.

So yeah, I don’t know if the audience would be familiar with this, but maybe it’s going to show my age, too. But it was a time of torrents as well, so you could sort of download the torrent for Photoshop. Yeah, so that’s what I did, and it just kind of stuck and I loved it, and I just kept going with it, up until eventually I left my job at the end of 2020. I was like, “I’m going to be a full-time creative solopreneur,” and it’s been one hell of a ride ever since then.

Maurice Cherry:
Yeah, I think there’s certainly going to be a good bit of our audience that relates to using a cracked version of Photoshop to start learning about how to design. That’s how I started up. I was using a cracked version of Photoshop, and I was going to a local bookstore, and I mean, I’m dating myself now. This is early… not early, maybe mid-2000s or so, 2004, 2005. Because there used to be these books published about Photoshop, like Photoshop 6: Dirty Tips and Tricks, and it would show you all these different little effects that you could make. “This is how you make a metal effect. This is how you make a gold effect. This is how you make a water effect.” And I didn’t have the money to purchase those books because those things were $50. I was like, “I don’t have $50 to buy this book, but what I can do is write down all the steps in my notebook and take it back home, or I could take a picture,” because I had this little dinky point and shoot camera, and I would take a picture of the page and just go back home and download the pictures and have the picture up, and then have Photoshop up and try to mimic the steps and stuff. So I mean, that’s how you learn. It’s that hands-on kind of stuff. So I completely, completely understand where you’re coming from there.

Fungi Dube:
Yeah. I mean, it’s a real life case of trust the process.

Maurice Cherry:
Yeah. When you look back at your time in college, you were studying human anatomy, physiology, biochemistry. In hindsight, did you see any elements of design in that work?

Fungi Dube:
Yeah, actually, because now, especially when it comes to maybe my research methodology just for creative projects, I see that I borrow a lot from what I learned during that time. So even when it comes to general experiments, obviously you’ve got to know what sort of equipment you’re going to use. You got to know what you need in order to get a certain result, you’re going to have to evaluate that result. Maybe you’re going to have to redo things and that sort of thing.

So that entire process of being able to design an experiment, I think is the same thing that I use now when it comes to coming up with concepts for brands. The research part of it definitely comes from there, because I can read any sort of, what may seem very boring content, especially within my line of work and my influences. I probably need to also read research papers, see what other maybe anthropologists or just historians have come up with regards to a certain topic. So that’s pages and pages of just literature, and I blur through that with ease. It doesn’t even feel like anything to me because I think just having been trained in a specific way when it came to my formal education really has helped a lot, and more so even when it comes to coming up with solutions and dissecting briefs and that sort of thing, I see a lot of my scientific background coming to play there. In hindsight, I’m definitely grateful for it because I think it’s made me a better creative and it’s also made me a better problem solver and a better thinker. So yeah, I definitely see how the two roles come together to form something quite beautiful.

Maurice Cherry:
Yeah, that’s great that your scientific background influences your approach because we were talking earlier about research. If you were a doctor or you just try to diagnose someone or just jump right in without doing research, you would not be a good doctor. So similarly, it’s the same way with design. You have to do that research to know, “Well, what’s the best approach? How do I know the best way to tackle this particular thing?” As you mentioned that, it just reminded me of what I’ve went through as a math… I don’t want to say a mathematician, but my degree as a math. I didn’t study design professionally. I just studied as a hobby and managed to turn it into a career. And when I look back even at the times where I was drawing 3D graphs by hand on a chalkboard or trying to create certain graphs and functions in mathematical or whatever, tessellations, fractals, et cetera, there’s design in those elements, too. There’s a lot of design in math that I don’t think probably, I don’t want to say traditional designers, but I think most designers probably don’t look at math that way. It’s funny, I even mentioned it and folks are like, “Ugh, math, I hate math.” And I mean, I like math.

Fungi Dube:
I don’t blame them. I don’t blame them. It’s math [inaudible 00:36:14]

Maurice Cherry:
But I mean, I think what math does, and probably similarly to what you have went through studying anatomy and physiology and biochemistry, it gives you a different way to process information. So for you, it’s really about making sure that you have that thorough research to execute the designs in the right way. When I think about math, math really taught me how to structure my thinking and that I’ve been able to use in proofs, in proposals, in any sorts of things when it comes to getting that message across succinctly to a client or something like that. So for designers out there that are like, “Ugh, the sciences,” don’t rule out the sciences. There’s ways that you can tie these things together.

Fungi Dube:
Yeah. And it’s actually so interesting, because like you’re saying it really shapes your process and how you dissect creativity in general. I’ve had the most interesting conversations. I feel like some of the most interesting conversations I’ve had are obviously with you right now because this is very enlightening, but also with people who have made career pivots, so accountants who are now creatives or medical doctors, which is so crazy, who are now creatives or engineers who are now creatives. And also just looking into their process and how they do things and how even the final outcome looks. It’s so interesting, because you see how based off of the different professional backgrounds or the different educational backgrounds, the process is just going to be entirely different, but the outcome is going to be just as beautiful. Sorry. So it’s just really interesting just seeing how people merge all these different worlds and then just come up with this solid body of creative work. It’s fascinating to me, absolutely fascinating.

Maurice Cherry:
Yeah. What do you want our audience to know about, I guess, design in Zimbabwe? What do you want them to know about, whether it’s the work that you see coming out of it, other creatives that you know that are kind of on the rise? What do you want to let our audience know about that?

Fungi Dube:
Oh, gosh, there’s so much. I just wish that this was a video presentation and I could show you some of the work because it’s so good. But I think if anything, there’s a shift. There’s a shift, and I definitely want to speak on this, but not in greater detail because that’s not why we are here. But I think there has been a lot of external imposition on what creative work looks like or should look like based off of history and colonization and everything that has happened.

So there’s this massive shift where what we are trying to do is to decolonize design in the sense that we want to say, “Hey, design can actually look like this, and that’s perfectly fine. Photography can look like this, and that’s perfectly fine.” So if anything, like I was referring to earlier, within the creative scene in Zimbabwe, there is definitely a lot that is coming up and on the rise, but even as you engage with the visuals, when you engage with the patterns, with the colors, with the execution, and I spoke of how you have these fashion shows that are being done in the most unlikely locations, you see that there’s definitely this big drive to ensure that the work is great, but also the way that the work is executed and the way that people engage with the work is unlike anything that we’ve seen before.

So it’s really, really exciting just seeing how more young Africans are stepping into their own really claiming and owning their identity and are just saying, “Hey, this may be a lot for people to take in. Maybe it’s too African, maybe it’s just too much energy, but it’s fine because this is who we are and we want to be able to tell our story the way that it should be told.” So yeah, it’s fun times ahead, fun times ahead. Fun times ahead. Let’s look into the future. Two years from now, five years from now, I believe that Zimbabwe and Zimbabwean creativity and Zimbabwean design is going to be on a whole other level.

Maurice Cherry:
What do you consider to be your biggest success in your design career so far?

Fungi Dube:
I am going to go more on the qualitative route, where I feel like my biggest success has been the chance and the opportunity to be able to connect with other creatives who are like me and have them sort of recognize themselves in the work that I do. I could easily say something like, “Oh, I worked with a client who paid me X amount, or I did this and that,” but I think that just the sense of community is something that has really, really, really, really impacted me the most.

I get so much joy when I’m able to talk to, or someone who’s just an up and coming designer or thinking of design, and they’re based maybe in Kenya or they’re based in Burundi, and they just write me a message on social. They’re like, “Hey, I saw your work and I just absolutely feel really inspired that I can actually sort of tap into my own culture and see what I can come up with,” and that sort of thing. And that is something that really, really, really, really, like I can wake up every day to that and not get paid a single dime and I’ll be fine. So that has been my biggest success, my biggest achievement, and I want to see how I can continue to build on that and see how I can continue to hopefully inspire and encourage other young African creatives to really step up and showcase your work and showcase their heritage, their culture, your tradition, and just take that to the global market. So yeah, that’s it for me.

Maurice Cherry:
Now, you’ve mentioned, I read this as I was sort of doing my research, you mentioned that you find inspiration from within when it comes to your work. Can you talk with me a little bit more about that? How do you build that sort of internal fortitude? How do you build that?

Fungi Dube:
So it hasn’t always been there, and I should be very honest about that because I think that as we were growing up and also the public education system that we’re exposed to, a lot of what we were taught doesn’t really resonate with who we are. So I probably at that point knew a lot more about Western history than I did about my own history, and I think that is something that needs to be fixed. So the resolve, I guess, or the tenacity has really come from wanting to do more when it comes to that. And I sort of had my light bulb moment when I encountered a book by well known as Zimbabwean graphic designer, but he’s also known in the international community. His name is Professor Saki Mafundikwa. He actually went to school in New York, I believe. So he studied there, and then he came back and he started the first graphic design school here in Zimbabwe.

He’s also given a TED Talk, and in his TED Talk he talks about looking for inspiration within. So after encountering his book, which is called African Alphabets, I was completely blown away because again, it comes back to that whole issue of documentation where I didn’t really know that it was possible to document African design systems in the way that he did. And it’s mostly based on typography and it’s absolutely fascinating stuff. So if anything, that’s where the initial point of contact or inspiration came from, and it just made so much sense to me because I had sort of been lost in this design world where I was doing anything and everything. And I’m sure you can attest to this as well, when you start out, you do everything. You’ll do your company profile, you’ll do a brochure, you’ll do a flyer, a poster, doesn’t really matter what the subject matter is.

I mean, it does, don’t get me wrong, because people will be like, “Hey, what kind of things were you designing?” But not in that sense. But that point gave me a sense of direction and really inspired me to be like, “Hey, actually we can flip this thing around. Let’s take all of these fundamentals that we’ve learned and convey them into a message that I would actually want for people to engage with and a message that I would want to see myself in.”

So I guess that is where that internal resolution has come from, and it’s been the driving and motivating factor ever since then to be like, “What can I do today? What can I do different? How can I take this story that people may have perceived in this way or this narrative and turn it into something that’s Afro-positive?” Because there are a lot of stories, there are a lot of things that I see about who we are and what we do and where we eat and where we live and that sort of thing and the world may see us a certain way, but I’m like, “No, actually, if we take power and we actually tell our story the way that it’s supposed to be told, then there’s so much more that we can actually get out of that.”

So really the looking within is to say as much as I can go out and seek inspiration online, on Pinterest, on [inaudible 00:46:11], what is in my backyard? Because when you look at the global and historical context, even between the two of us, we may share the same skin color, but when it comes to our historical context, our global context, there’s absolutely no way that you would be able to design like a designer who is in Harare, Zimbabwe, when you’re in Atlanta, Georgia. It’s just different.

So that’s where really the looking within comes into be like, “Hey, what am I exposed to? What do I see on a daily? What sort of conversations can I have to seek inspiration? Can I go and speak to an outside vendor and find out how he weaves his basket? Can I have a conversation with my grandmother about how she designed her mud hut kitchen and all the paintings and murals that are on the outside?” Things like that really, really make a difference because you actually start to see that there’s creativity in a lot of the crafts that I see around me, and how can I leverage that? What can I draw from their processes as well, and how can I turn that into this fresh thing and tell it in a different way for everyone else on the internet to interact with? So that is really where it comes from.

Maurice Cherry:
At this stage of your career, how do you define success?

Fungi Dube:
Ooh, that is a loaded question, now, isn’t it?

Maurice Cherry:
Is it?

Fungi Dube:
Yeah, because I’ve really got to think about it. But I think at this stage, what I think is really cool and what I’m really grateful for is the fact that even in interactions where I may not be there, so whether it’s physical spaces, whether it’s calls, it’s the fact that people are able to sort of recognize my work, and I think that’s so cool.

I get humbled every single time when I go on LinkedIn and someone will maybe tag me or mention me and be like, “Hey, is this your work?” And I’ll be like, “Oh, no, it’s not my work, but I think that it’s so cool that you think that it could be my work.” So that really, really, really, really inspires me and motivates me to keep going. Just the fact that I’m in a position where people tend to think of me when it comes to a certain style or when it comes to a certain interpretation of design, I think it’s super cool. So that is one of my proudest moments, I think, and I’ve been working hard at it, so I’m glad that it’s paying off.

Maurice Cherry:
What advice would you give to any aspiring designers out there that maybe want to sort of follow in your footsteps? What would you tell them?

Fungi Dube:
This is going to sound so cliche, but I think the thing is to just go for it. I have come to learn that there are beautiful things that grow when you step outside of your comfort zone. It’s not the easiest thing to do, but I think that if you put yourself in a position where you’re like, “Okay, this is a little bit crazy, it’s a little bit scary. I have absolutely no idea how I am going to pull this off, but I’m going to go for it,” which is sort of what I had to do.

So I spoke of leaving my job, but I was sort of unsafe, like unfairly dismissed. In pandemic year in 2020 was the most heartbreaking experience ever. And I was kind of left thinking, “Whoa, what am I going to do with this thing and how am I going to make money and how am I going to take care of myself,” and everything like that. But you realize that certain doors get shut and they get shut in the most uncomfortable way ever because they’re sort of pushing you to get to the next thing, to start working on the next thing.

So if anything, if it feels a little bit scary, if it feels like you have absolutely no idea how you are going to do it, then I would encourage you to go for that thing because you never know what’s going to come out of it. But I mean, go with it. Go in it, sorry, having a plan of sorts. It may not be something that’s super solid, but at least make sure that you work on your strategy, make sure that you know what it is that you want to be doing and where you’re going to be doing it and who you’re going to be doing it with. Write all of that down and see if you can break it down into actionable steps and then see how far you can push it. But that really would be my advice. If you want to make a career pivot, too. I mean, former mathematician who says that he doesn’t want to call himself a mathematician and former scientist-ish over here. So if you also want to transition, if you want to go over the bridge, it’s never too late. You can always do that, as well.

Maurice Cherry:
Where do you see yourself in the next five years? What do you want your next chapter to look like?

Fungi Dube:
Oh, I love this. I definitely see myself in design education. So as we have been talking, I’ve been talking about documenting processes and that sort of thing, and I am grateful that I’ve already sort of started dipping my toes in design education when it comes to my mentorship and my coaching role with Flux Academy. So we work with brand… we work with students across the world to enroll for various design programs, and one of them happens to be a brand design program. So I sort of offer them support with that. I offer them feedback as they go through their modules and everything like that. It’s a very diverse group of students, as young as 20, as old as 70. So it’s very interesting seeing what that is like, but it really feels like sort of the next step for me because I really want to see myself more in the African design education space. So can we have more design curriculum? Can we have more design curriculum that is geared towards African creatives? Can we get more literature? Can we get more books? Can you get more additional platforms that help African students learn about design and a more African aesthetic? Things like that. So that’s definitely where I would want to see myself five years from now.

Maurice Cherry:
And just to wrap things up here, where can our audience find out more information about you, about your work and everything? Where can they find that online?

Fungi Dube:
I am everywhere except for TikTok because it scares me. I have a burner account on TikTok where I just follow amazing people, but the comments section scares me there. So you can always find me on my website, so fungidube.com, or my social links are also on my website, so you can find my Behance, you can find my Twitter, you can find my Instagram. You can also find my LinkedIn there, but it’s fungidube.com.

Maurice Cherry:
All right. Sounds good. Fungi Dube, I want to thank you so much for coming on the show. One, I think it’s awesome that you can give us just a window into what it’s like being a creative solopreneur in Africa, in Zimbabwe, giving us a sense of what that looks like. But also, just thank you for sharing your story about just determination and passion and how you’ve been able to really cultivate that creative engine within to create great work and showing people that you don’t necessarily have to go down a specific path, no pun intended for the name of the show, but you don’t have to go down a specific path in order to become a creative, be a creative, and even to leverage your own culture in the work that you do. So thank you so much for coming on the show. I appreciate it.

Fungi Dube:
Thank you so much for having me. This has been so much fun, now.

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Matese Fields

When did you fall in love with design? While some people have always been able to tap into that creative spark, for others it might take some time trying different things until you find your way into design. Such is the case with this week’s guest, independent brand designer Matese Fields. His explorations have taken him all over the country, and now he’s living and working in the creative hub of Portland, Oregon.

Matese told me a bit about some of his latest projects, and then he shared what inspired him to get into design. He also spoke about how his background in marketing helps him in his current work, and gave some great advice and resources for any budding brand designers out there. Matese has been able to make a living and build a life by following his passions, which is something we can all get inspired by!

Interview Transcript

Maurice Cherry:
All right, so tell us who you are and what you do.

Matese Fields:
I am Matese Fields, and I am an independent brand and product designer in Portland, Oregon.

Maurice Cherry:
Nice. How has 2023 been going for you so far?

Matese Fields:
2023 has been fantastic. I had a pretty rough 2022. Honestly, one of the worst years I’ve had in a long time. So I think when I came in 2023, I kind of came into this mindset like, “That’s not happening again.” And it hasn’t. So far it’s been great. I feel like for the first time in a long time, I’m kind of firing on all cylinders, so it feels good.

Maurice Cherry:
Well, that’s good. That’s a good turnaround. I mean, I think 2022 was a rough year for a lot of people. Particularly if you were working in tech, or design, or something because of a bunch of layoffs and stuff. COVID is still around. A lot of people had a rough year. I had a rough year last year too, so I completely a hundred percent understand where you’re coming from.

Matese Fields:
Definitely.

Maurice Cherry:
I saw on Instagram you just finished up a branding campaign last month. Can you talk to me about that?

Matese Fields:
Yeah, that was one of the high points of my 2022. I got to work with a company called Black Campaign School. And so I kind of partnered with this group called Three Point Strategies, and helped them reboot what Black Campaign School is. And so they’ve been around I think since 2016. We kind of came in with the goal of differentiating it from some of that kind of DC vibe. Super political, red, white, and blue theme that they had originally had. So yeah, I came in, worked with them on the branding side of determining what Black Campaign School is, sort of redoing that logo, a lot of their brand identity. And then we built out a lot of stuff for their reboot of the actual physical school, which was really cool. I got to do a lot of physical stuff for the camp, which is located at Haley Farm in Tennessee. It’s a really cool, historically Black farm in Tennessee. So yeah, it was great.

Maurice Cherry:
You said red, white, and blue. Was it a political advocacy group or something?

Matese Fields:
Yeah. So basically the goal of Black Campaign School is to teach people who are really involved with campaigning and that organizing for social justice and stuff like that. It’s kind of a school to teach them how to use that and take that to politics, and run for office, or boost that up a little bit.

Maurice Cherry:
Interesting, okay. Yeah, because I was looking through the branding. It’s only as you mentioned it now that I was like, “This is political,” because the branding does not at all scream politics. Which I think is good. I mean, I’ve worked on a political campaign. So I feel like every campaign from California to Florida uses red, white, and blue in some iteration. So when you said that and you mentioned it, I was like, “Is that what it is?” But yeah, and I’ll put a link to it and everything so people can check out what the brand looks like, but I definitely did not get politics from it.

Matese Fields:
That’s great. We accomplished the goal for sure.

Maurice Cherry:
Nice. Are you working on any other projects at the moment?

Matese Fields:
Currently, no. So I kind of knew that January was going to be more of a slow month for me. So a lot of January was me just trying to get my stuff in order. So updating my portfolio. I’m kind of in the midst of getting my LLC. So doing a lot of work with that. Doing a lot of promoting on social media, just trying to get my work out there.

But I am starting a new project on Monday, which is exciting. It’s a small little contract gig with Breville, which they make tabletop coffee makers and stuff like that. So that’ll be fun. And then on another fun side, I started a Euchre club. I’m not sure if you’re familiar what Euchre is,

Maurice Cherry:
Spades, right?

Matese Fields:
Similar to Spades, but not quite. It’s like a game of tricks, but it has a little different nuanced than Spades. But I’m from the Midwest originally, so it’s a big, Midwest thing for us. So I started a club with a group of 14 of my friends. And I was like, “Well, I don’t have that much to do. Why not just kind of act like this is a project?” So I made a logo for it, got swag made for it, and stuff. So it’s been kind of a fun thing to do.

Maurice Cherry:
Nice. I have not heard Euchre since, and I’m dating myself here. I haven’t heard Euchre since Yahoo Games. I think Yahoo Games had Euchre. I think they also had Spades too, but they had Hearts of course, Literati, stuff like that. What drew you to Euchre? Is it a distinctly Midwest game?

Matese Fields:
I think it is. It’s fun when you have a group of a few people. And I feel like every time we’d be hanging out at somebody’s house, all my friends in Portland are from the Midwest in some capacity. So it’s like whenever we’d hang out, we’d be like, “Let’s play Euchre.”

And so we actually had this party back in end of last year, and it was called the Midwest Fest. My friend put it on. Basically it was a party, and everyone brought casseroles, and everything was themed Midwest. There was corn hole, and there was a bonfire, and everything you do in the country of the Midwest. And so we ended up playing Euchre there, and there was so many people interested. We were like, “Why not just start a club?” So yeah, it kind of started from there.

Maurice Cherry:
Interesting. Urban Dictionary defines Euchre as a four-person trump-based, not the president, trump-based card game primarily played on Midwestern college campuses involving a 24 card deck and many beers. Is that accurate?

Matese Fields:
That is insanely accurate. Lot of beers are had. Yes. I started playing in college. That is so accurate.

Maurice Cherry:
What inspired you to become a brand designer?

Matese Fields:
I honestly never saw this for myself. I think if you would’ve talked to me five, 10 years ago, I’d have been like, “No.” But I don’t know. I’ve always been creative in a sense. It hasn’t always been in the design or art sense. But I’ve always kind of had an eye for creativity.

And so when I first started my career, I was very UX/UI heavy, which I love. But it wasn’t quite fulfilling me. And so I kind of always knew that eventually there would be more transition to a more creative side of design. And I tried a lot of different things. I was like, “I’m going to be an illustrator.” And I started doing that. I’m like, “Maybe I’m not going to be an illustrator.” And then I really was into type design for a little bit and I was like, “I’m going to be a type designer.” It wasn’t my time for that either. And so I think just as my career went on, I kind of started forming myself to be more of a brand designer, and then just jumping in and trying to get those opportunities. So yeah, I think that’s it. There’s no straightforward answer for it.

Maurice Cherry:
Well, I think it’s good that you were able to explore these different facets of design before you landed on something that worked for you. That’s a good thing.

Matese Fields:
Definitely. I think my entire life has been try everything you can. That was kind of what my whole college career was. I think that’s just the way that works best for me it I want to try as much stuff as I can. And then when it sticks, it sticks.

Maurice Cherry:
Yeah. How would you describe your design process, when you get a new project? What goes through your mind as you’re putting everything together?

Matese Fields:
The minute I get a proposal, or an inquiry or email, thoughts are already running my head. My brain is just going at a thousand miles a minute at all times. So when I first get an email, I kind of already am thinking through what could be. So that’s one part.

I think the biggest part for me when it comes to working on a project, especially independently, is really getting close with the client. So really determining what is right for them. So with that comes a lot of questions. I like to sit down and just dig deep, and know everything that I can about this client, and why this project is happening, and what they want to get out of it, and the origin behind the company, and the name, and everything. So that’s definitely a big part of the process.

And then I would say, this is something I kind of learned from my time at Work & Co, but I like to show often. I’m not a huge wire frame or sketch things out type of guy. I like to just get in and get dirty super quick. And with that comes a lot of bad things quite, frankly. But I think part of my process is being really consistent with showing how I’m getting to the point that I’m getting to.

So at Work & Co, we should work every day. And it wasn’t always the greatest work, and sometimes it didn’t make sense. But it really helps to form that story around how you get to that final product.

I think one part of my process is definitely just showing a lot of work. Even if I don’t think it’s great or could be tweaked, just showing that process and being super transparent about that. So yeah, that’s the early stages of the process, definitely.

Maurice Cherry:
So it’s a lot of information gathering at first, it sounds like.

Matese Fields:
Yeah, definitely. I want to know everything that I can. And Dropbox Paper is my best friend. I just have things jotted down everywhere.

Maurice Cherry:
So do you start off digital, or do you start off analog?

Matese Fields:
Usually digital, honestly. Yeah, I’ve never been a sketcher or anything like that. So yeah, definitely digitally.

Maurice Cherry:
Okay. What do you think are the most important elements of a successful brand design?

Matese Fields:
I think honestly, the storytelling forming the story around what the brand is. And that will kind of seep into ultimately, what the look of the brand is going to be. So I’ve always kind of worked I guess, in between a lot of the strategy sides and design sides. So I think the storytelling is definitely the biggest part of the brand. Just a strong idea of what this brand is. And then that will easily flow into what is the actual part of the visual side of it.

Maurice Cherry:
Is it easy to get the client online with that? To let them know that yeah, we are talking about brand. But actually, we’re going to dive more into what story is being told? Because I feel like sometimes, clients just want to see something. They want to see something visual so they can either accept it or reject it. Most likely reject it, but they kind of want to see something.

Matese Fields:
Yeah, for sure. I do think it is sometimes a little difficult getting them on board with that. But I think I’m a big part of, “This is what I did on X project, and this is how I can work with you to get you to that point.” And it might start super dry, and you might not see anything for a little bit. But once we nail it down, it’s going to be really easy to get to that point where the visuals are going to be. And I think that definitely helps with that conversation for sure.

Maurice Cherry:
Has there ever been a time where you’ve kind of started out in that beginning process, and then by the time you got to the finished product, it was something completely different?

Matese Fields:
Yeah, I’m trying to think of a specific time. But I think that honestly, it kind of happened a little bit with the Black Campaign School. We kind of knew what it was that we wanted to do and wanted to accomplish. But I think the vision of the end goal was a lot different or the vision of the visuals at the end were a lot different. We ended in this more regal, dark, purple, really showcasing the people and the what behind Black Campaign School. And I think the original was we wanted to be happy, and flowing, and pastels, and stuff like that. Yeah, I mean I think there’s been definitely been a lot of times when that’s happened for sure.

Maurice Cherry:
So I want to learn more about you and you. You’ve alluded a bit already since we were talking about Euchre, about your origins in the Midwest. So let’s go back there. Tell me about where you grew up.

Matese Fields:
Yeah. I’m originally from Columbus, Ohio. I grew up in the city up through seventh grade. Went to Columbus City Schools. And then when I was in seventh grade, we moved to the country of Columbus. We moved to this little town called Lithopolis, which is 30 minutes south of Columbus. And I went to a really tiny high school called Bloom-Carroll, which was in the middle of a cornfield basically. Went from a middle school of 1,500 kids to a high school of 380. That was a huge change in my life. And then I went there all through high school.

And then after high school, went to a small college called Capital University, which is about five minutes from Ohio State. Small, kind of private liberal arts college. And then was there all throughout college and a couple years after college, and then kind of moved around the Midwest. I lived in Chicago for a little bit. I lived in Detroit for a little bit. And yeah, now I’m in Portland. Rainy Portland, Oregon.

Maurice Cherry:
Growing up, were you really creative? Were you drawing and sketching a lot, or something like that?

Matese Fields:
No, I was honestly the complete opposite. I’ve always been really creative, but it was more in the music form. Art was my least favorite class. Yeah, it’s really crazy.

But I always kind of had this weird affinity, now that I think about it, for design. I was really meticulous about how my handwriting looked, how my signature looked, and how my notes were organized. So I always had that sense of, I guess design in a sense, but I just didn’t really know it back then.

I was a big music kid. I started playing violin in elementary school. My parents had me in piano lessons when I was really young. And then when I got to middle school and high school, I switched to playing the clarinet. And I played the bass clarinet all through high school, ended up being really good at it. Had a lot of different musical honors and stuff like that in high school. And then actually went to college for music originally. Back then, I just knew I wanted to be a music teacher. I thought I was going to be this really great musical director, and work in colleges, and universities, and stuff like that. And quickly found out that was not what I wanted to do. But I’ve been really musical my whole life, but I haven’t been into art and design my entire life.

Maurice Cherry:
What turned you off from doing music?

Matese Fields:
I love playing music. That was my therapy when I was a kid. I think there was a couple things. When it came to me learning the intricacies, I wasn’t that interested. I just really wanted to play. I didn’t really want to do all the music theory, and learning piano, and all that.
So I think that was part of it. I think another part was I was not focused in college at all. Honestly, probably should have taken time off after high school before going to college, but my head just wasn’t there. It just kind of was like, “Okay, this is not for you. You can keep playing, but a career in music probably isn’t the best thing.”

Maurice Cherry:
Well, I’m thinking if you were playing bass clarinet, I’m trying to think what you would… You almost have to go into a symphony, I guess. When I think of house bands and stuff like that… I played trombone all through middle school, high school, college throughout my twenties. Every band kind of wants a trombone player, especially if you’re talking a club or something like that. But yeah, I would guess if you’re doing bass clarinet, that kind of limits options and venues for you to play, unless you go completely pro or something.

Matese Fields:
Definitely. And I think it’s actually probably one of the easier… If you’re really good at bass clarinet, I think it’s one of the easier instruments to get a gig with, because there aren’t a lot of people that play that instrument. And so I did during college and a little bit after college, I would play in different symphonic bands and stuff.

It was really fun. My piano teacher in college was a bass clarinet major. And so I think she eventually moved out of Ohio. And when she moved she was like, “I’m going to refer you for all these gigs for bass clarinet.” And so for a while, I did that where I get a call, we have a concert coming up. I’d go to the concert an hour before, run through all the music one time, and then play the concert. It was so much fun. And that was great. Being a teacher just wasn’t going to happen.

Maurice Cherry:
So when you were at Capital University, you majored in marketing. Tell me about what your time was like there.

Matese Fields:
Kind of going back to the idea of me trying everything and seeing if it sticks, that was kind of my entire college career. I originally came in as a music major. Music education major. Did that for I think a year, and half of my sophomore year. And then I was like, “Okay, that’s not working. But also, I don’t know what I want to do. And so I did everything.” I was like, “I’m going to be an accountant.” So I was an accounting major for a little while and then I was like, “I really don’t like math.” And then I was like, “I’m going to do psychology.” And then I was like, “Maybe I want to get into real estate.” I thought about transferring to Ohio State because they had a real estate program. And then eventually I was just like, “All right, just do marketing. It’s easy. I don’t know what I want to do in marketing, but it was easy.”

And so picked up a marketing major, stuck with it. And also like I was saying earlier, I just wasn’t really focused in college and didn’t really necessarily care about the schoolwork. But what I did know I enjoyed was working and doing internships.
So once I got that marketing major, I started doing internship after internship. My friends would always make fun of me because they’re like, “You’re onto the next internship.” And I did, I think 12 in college. All different companies, and just seeing where I fit in at marketing.

And then eventually, I started interning with a company called OhioHealth, which is a healthcare system in Ohio. And I was doing digital marketing there. And the team was basically just me and my boss. So I got to do a lot of different stuff. And for a while, I was really focused on analytics and the web side of things, but on a marketing perspective. So SEO and stuff like that. Yeah.
So then eventually I was there, and this kind of segues of how I got into design. I was working at the internship, been there for probably about a year and a half. And they came to me, my boss came to me and was like, “Hey, we need this webpage redesign.” And I was like, “Okay. I don’t really know what that means, but sure.”

And so took on that project, and it was really cool. I kind of got the lead up all the strategy behind it and how we are doing copy and stuff like that. And we didn’t even have design software, so I did wireframes and PowerPoint.
But it was just a really cool process. And then from there I was like, “Okay, I think this is what I want to do. I really like UX, and the web, and stuff like that.” So that’s how I got into design.

But long story short, didn’t do really well in school. But kind of picked up that marketing major and then found my way through internships rather than school. My goal for school is just get through it. Graduate so your parents are happy. But yeah, just get through it.

Maurice Cherry:
Well, I think that speaks to what you alluded to earlier with you were always trying a bunch of new things. And honestly, college is the place to do that. College is all about trying new stuff. There’s all sorts of clubs, and majors, and things like that. So it sounds like that really helped inform all of this, I don’t want to say trial and error. Because I don’t like the misconception that just because something maybe didn’t work out, that you didn’t learn something from it. So each of these explorations moved you closer to where you ultimately are now.

Matese Fields:
For sure. Definitely.

Maurice Cherry:
How do you feel like your marketing knowledge, how does that help you as a designer now?

Matese Fields:
I kind of think about this often, because I always joke, I’m like, “I’ve never used my degree.” But I definitely think it helps with my thought process behind how I approach design. So definitely from that strategy side of things, a lot of stuff we learned in college was around the strategy, and how you get to a point of determining what the [inaudible 00:28:46] is, and building a business plan, and SWOT analysis, and stuff like that. So I think my time at capital in the marketing side of things definitely helps with that aspect of how I approach and think through design. And I’ve always really been interested in the strategy side of things. And I think it’s because of that background that I have.

Maurice Cherry:
So it sounds like it’s not just about making it look pretty. Of course you want it to look pretty, but you also have the know-how behind like, “This is what people are going to gravitate towards. This is what it’s going to be something that catches someone’s eye.”

Matese Fields:
Yep, for sure.

Maurice Cherry:
Yeah. Now you were at StockX for almost two years. What do you remember from that time? What did that time there teach you?

Matese Fields:
Yes, StockX was great. Yeah, it was a really great place to work at for the time I did. When I first started there, I was pretty young in my career. That was my second full-time job that I had. And so it was really cool because the team, when I first started, it was three of us. My boss Jim Renaud, and then Evan Ames who was the senior designer on the team, and then me.

And it was really cool because I think from the moment I got there, they kind of just trusted me to do what I thought was best, which I was kind of looking for at that point in my career. And so yeah, StockX was really great. It was also just a large team. Our creative team, we had in-house photographers, in-house videographers, art directors that are great, still some of my best friends to this day. And so we just got to do a lot of stuff and got to throw a lot of things at the wall and just be like, “This is what StockX could be.”

So yeah, it was really cool. It taught me a lot about just how to build up that story around a design. We had a lot of ideas on what we wanted to do and how StockX could be better. But most of the job was proving that to the higher ups. So we had to do a lot of work around, “Okay, this is how we’re going to present this to the CMO and this is how we’re going to break out these projects.” And so it was really cool, and I think we got a lot accomplished there.

I worked on a team that was in charge of a lot of the front facing parts of StockX. So the homepage, and the product page, and the searching. And that team, I worked with a couple really great project managers, Leah and Lilly. And it was really cool. We just determined the next five years of StockX, and it was really great working together with them.

Maurice Cherry:
And now you also worked for some agencies as well. Earlier, you mentioned Work & Co, which I said this before we recorded, that Work & Co and Revision Path have a interesting relationship. It goes back a few years. I first became acquainted with them in 2018. I met one of their project managers at XOXO. How long have you been in Portland, by the way?

Matese Fields:
It’ll be two years on Sunday actually.

Maurice Cherry:
Okay. So you were there I think after XOXO stopped having live events, because they sort of stopped during the pandemic. But XOXO is like this, I guess the best way I could call it is an internet festival. Even saying it like that sounds weird when you think about the internet now. But it’s makers, and designers, and developers, and artists. The year that I went, Lizzo performed. It’s a pretty nice event. I hope they bring it back one day because it’s actually a lot of fun. But that’s how I first got acquainted with Work & Co, learned about they have all these international offices. They’ve even done some pro bono work for the show before. They’ve been a sponsor before.

Not really sure what’s happening with Work & Co. I know they’ve got an office here in Atlanta, which they did ask me to head up. And then that vanished in the thin air, but that’s a whole other story. I’m curious for you though, you’ve worked at Work & Co, you’ve worked at some other agencies. How were those experiences? Because I would imagine that’s probably different from a place like StockX, which I guess is more of an e-commerce startup in a way.

Matese Fields:
Yeah, definitely way different from StockX. The first agency I worked at was called Truth Labs. It was in Chicago. And that agency also is extremely different from how Work & Co works. That place, we kind of worked in silos. So one person owned a project, and we were kind of the project manager in a sense, and also the designer. It was a really great experience. My boss Tyson there was amazing, taught me a lot stuff.

But Work & Co is very different from any place I’ve really worked at. Their whole thing is collaboration, which is something that I hadn’t had a ton of in my career until I got there. So it was really interesting when I got there. I remember when I first started, the first three or four months, I was like, “I have no clue what I’m doing.” My head was in a whirlwind. And I remember I’d be working on stuff. It’s a little challenging when you first start because you do share work every day. So you’re like, “I want to share the best stuff every day.” And then you just kind of get in your head, and things never really turn out the way you want them to.

I remember working on a project and my boss Alex was like, “We need to talk. What is happening?” And I was just, “I don’t really know what’s happening here. I don’t know what’s going on,” blah, blah, blah. And it wasn’t because of the company, it was just so different. We just had a really long chat and she was just kind of like, “We’re not expecting you to be perfect every day. You just got to kind of show up on your own pace. Obviously we want you to do the work. Don’t feel that pressure to have to be perfect, and everything has to be whatever.”

So it was just like I really had to change my thought process around design. And I think for me, my brain is always going. And so that kind of translates into how I think about my work, and how it first comes on a paper. It’s just once again, me throwing things out there, and seeing what sticks. And working at Work & Co, I really had to simplify my thought process to fit into their mold of how they work, which is interesting.

Maurice Cherry:
Okay, you got to unpack that interesting now. You got to unpack that a little bit.

Matese Fields:
Yeah, I mean Work & Co does fantastic work. Everyone I work there with is so talented and literally every day I’d be like, “How are you doing this?” They work how they work, and that is it. There is no changing their process. You just have to assimilate into that process. And I think that’s where some of the friction comes from.

It works really well, and they do really great stuff. So I guess in a sense it’s like, who am I to change that? So I fell into that, and it was great. I did one of the biggest and best projects in my career there for the PGA TOUR. But yeah, it’s just really different. You just got to fall in and trust the process there. And for me that was hard to do, and I think is what led me to moving towards being independent.

Maurice Cherry:
Are all agencies like that? I can’t say all because you haven’t worked for all agencies, but you’ve worked for different types of agencies. Is this an agency thing, this opinionated way of working? Or was that just unique to them?

Matese Fields:
Honestly, I would say it’s somewhat unique to them. I do think when I was at Truth Labs, there was a lot more flexibility in how we wanted to structure the project. We worked in weekly sprints, but it was kind of up to you to determine what would be in that sprint, and how you would go about it, and how you present it to the client. Whereas Work & Co’s like, “Okay, we’re meeting every day. You’re sharing work every day.” You’re not sharing work to the client every day, but you’re sharing work to the overall team every day. Your reviews what the clients are on this day, this day. We are showing these three directions only. The way we’re presenting them is very structured. I think it’s fairly unique to them. I’ve freelanced for a lot of agencies also, and I think I’ve always had a little bit more flexibility in how to structure things.

Maurice Cherry:
It’s very interesting that you said that’s what pushed you to becoming independent. Sometimes you have to be in a, we’ll say less than ideal work situation. We’ll say that. Sometimes, you have to be in that situation to know what you don’t want.

And this also plays into what you’ve mentioned earlier with trying new things. This was another new thing that you tried. Wasn’t necessarily for you. But it’s again, pushing you closer to the ideal experience that you want to have, which I’m guessing right now is you being independent.

Matese Fields:
Definitely. I really enjoy my time at Work & Co, and I think it was definitely necessary for my career. I learned so much in the year and a half I was there. Honestly crazy. The process does work, if you’re really willing to adapt to that and fall into that. It’ll work great.

Maurice Cherry:
It’s different. Not for you.

Matese Fields:
And they are very product heavy too. And while I love product work, I definitely did want to focus more on brand. That was also part of it for sure.

Maurice Cherry:
Got you. Speaking of brands, what trends in brand design do you think are going to be important in the coming years? I feel like we have so much with technology, and AI, and machine learning, and all this stuff. That it seems like creativity in a way, is pushing to be automated. So from your perspective, what do you think the future of brand design’s going to look like?

Matese Fields:
It’s crazy. It’s hard to keep up with all this stuff. I don’t know. I’m not falling into the automation craze yet. I mean, you’ve seen the pictures where it’s like, “The generated AI photos,” and everyone has six and seven fingers on a hand. There’s work to be done to push us out.

I think Gen Z is going to define a lot of what we see in the future. It seems like they’re kind of running the world right now, with influencing, and TikTok, and all that stuff. So I think a lot of brands are going to have to pivot to fall in line with that. Obviously, it depends on the brand if you’re doing B2B stuff that it doesn’t necessarily matter as much. But I think that’s going to be definitely big. You’ve already kind of seen it. Somebody was telling me about, they got rid of Sierra Mist and changed it to some brand. I don’t even remember what the name is, but-

Maurice Cherry:
Starry.

Matese Fields:
Yeah, Starry. To make it more popular for Gen Z. I think that’s a big thing. I think minimalism. It’s already kind of coming back, or it’s already prevalent a lot. But I think minimalism and really being direct with your brand is going to be really big. And I think a lot of that is rooted in typography, which I love. So yeah, I think that’s going to be big. But yeah, I think as we move forward, it’s definitely going to be a lot around how you position yourself in how your brand is showing up to the world. And it kind of goes back into the strategy, and the copy, and the brand voice. That’s going to be really big.

Maurice Cherry:
I think we’re going to start seeing less virtual experiences, and more in-person experiences. And when I say that, I mean of course, I’d say over the past two years or so, companies were starting to dip their toe into the metaverse. And they’re like, “We’re making these virtual campuses and all,” all this stuff that nobody was going to. Because it costs $300 to get Meta Quest 2 to join this thing, and you don’t have any legs, and there’s only 12 people in here. No one was really going for that.

But I saw brands, I know Taco Bell did this. Where they had a Taco Bell room, a hotel room. And you could I guess spend the night in the room, and it would be all decked out in… It’s like a 360 brand experience where Taco Bell’s everywhere. You get Taco Bell room service. All this sort of stuff.

I see that sort of stuff I think coming more and more. I mean I think that kind of plays to social media and brands and influencers because they’d probably be the ones that would like all that kind of gaudy stuff. But I see brands starting to create more of these in-person things, especially as folks start to get back out into the world more. These past few years, we’ve all been in the house, on Zoom, on Teams, on Google Meet, etc. Now people want to get out, but they want to still, I think, be able to do it safely. And I think companies will start to figure out maybe how they can have these sorts of 360 type of experiences that people will gravitate towards.

Matese Fields:
Definitely. I totally agree with that. You’re definitely seeing it everywhere. I know in Columbus, it’s been there for a while. But there’s a brewery BrewDog in Columbus. And they have a hotel like that too. It’s like you can take a bath in beer.

Maurice Cherry:
What?!

Matese Fields:
Just a bunch of crazy stuff. I don’t know if that’s actually true, but I know the hotel room is very geared towards people who are very heavily into brewing, and the process of beer, and stuff like that.

Maurice Cherry:
Yeah, bath and beer, that doesn’t sound good. But I see why people would do it for the novelty.

Matese Fields:
Yeah, who knows. Might be good for your skin or something.

Maurice Cherry:
It could be. It could be. What advice would you give to someone who wants to start out in brand design? What would you tell them? Resources or anything like that?

Matese Fields:
I think throw as much as you can out there and just see what happens. I definitely think it’s easy to get caught up finding inspiration through other brands and media forms. Like Dribbble, or Pinterest, or whatever. But I think a big part of design is getting out into the world, and finding inspiration by things that are off your screen. So I think that’s definitely a big thing.

I would say read a lot. I have so much to learn from an art history perspective, because I never had that design school education. So I’ve been really just trying to learn more about that. So definitely, learning more about the roots and the origins. I think those would be my biggest things.

I never really had a dedicated mentor. But I think that finding someone who you can come back to, and who will be honest with you, and really keep it real with you is definitely important as well. And learn typography. I think that’s huge. Really learn how to use type. It’s big.

Maurice Cherry:
How do you make time for joy these days?

Matese Fields:
I love sports. I play a lot of basketball. I have been getting back into weightlifting, so I’ve been doing that a lot recently. I’ve been getting back into playing golf. I used to play with my dad a lot when I was younger. So trying to get back into that. I love reality TV, because it is easy to watch, and you don’t have to be invested in it. So I watch a lot of reality TV. I’ve always watched a ton of reality TV.

I have a ton of plants. Really big into plant life, taking care of plants. And I am really big into things. Anyone who knows me knows I just have a bunch of stuff. My mom, when I was a kid, she would always make fun of me. She’s like, “You’re a pack rat. You don’t throw anything out. You just keep everything.”

And so I have a lot of things. I like to go vintage and antique shopping a lot. So I’m constantly rearranging the house or rearranging my room, and just trying to find ways to use all these things that I have. Yeah, that’s probably the biggest. Play a lot of video games, play a lot of Euchre. I’m always busy. I just try to stay busy at all times.

Maurice Cherry:
What video games are you playing?

Matese Fields:
Recently, I just been playing Call of Duty and 2K, which I know is kind of boring. But I grew up, I really loved RPGs and those open world games when I was younger. So sometimes I’ll fall deep into that.

I’ve been playing Horizon Forbidden West a little bit. I’ve played Uncharted for probably 10 times. It’s like my favorite game ever. I used to be really big in Assassin’s Creed, Red Dead Redemption, stuff like that. I’ve been trying to get back into Last of Us, but that game makes me mad. It frustrates me. I might just have to watch the show and not-

Maurice Cherry:
I was going to say, I feel like that’s popular right now because of the show. People are trying to get back into the game.

Matese Fields:
Yeah. So yeah, I played halfway through and then I was just like, “I can’t do this anymore.”

Maurice Cherry:
So earlier you said when you were giving your advice for people that wanted to get into brand design, you said that they should seek motivation in other things. So what are the things that keep you motivated and inspired?

Matese Fields:
Honestly, it sounds cliché. But everything, honestly. My mind is always going. I’m always thinking about something. Whether it’s something I’m working on or something that could be. So I’ll get random inspiration from anything. The other day, I was driving through Portland, and I saw street sign. It sparked something for the Euchre league that I was doing.

So I definitely draw inspiration from being out in the world. But I would say to get more specific, I get a lot of inspiration from music artists and musicians. I’ve really been into street wear lately. So a lot of different street wear designers. Mainly Joe Freshgoods. He’s such a huge inspiration to me, mainly because he does whatever he wants. But there’s always this story behind why he’s doing something, which I think is super inspirational. He just does great stuff, and it’s always for the community and for other people.

So he’s a big inspiration. I would say I get a lot of inspiration from people who just build things. It doesn’t necessarily have to be design related. But Mike Smith from Smith & Diction, everything he does is incredible. The way he talks about his work is really great. People from Lichen. They’re a company in New York, and they do a lot of stuff with furniture and physical items. I think their story is super great.

My friend Alex Tan, he started a studio called Mouthwash. I’ve actually known Alex. We haven’t talked in a while, but I’ve known him since middle school. But he’s doing really great stuff. He’s always been super… I remember in college, we went to the same college. We went to the same church in high school. I remember in college we’d just be talking and everything he’d say, I’m like, “You don’t need to be here. Go do your own thing.” He’s just so smart.

So I think he’s doing really great stuff. Ryan Putnam also. He’s a really great fine artist. I think his story’s really cool of how he does things independently, on his own schedule. So yeah, I mean anything and everyone for sure, I would say.

Maurice Cherry:
Keeping it real Midwest with Joe Freshgoods.

Matese Fields:
Yeah. For my Chicago Days.

Maurice Cherry:
And Black. Well, I guess people know he’s a Black designer. I don’t know if that’s totally evident from the name, but yeah.

Matese Fields:
Definitely. Like the Lichen, they’re both Black designers. Definitely pulling inspiration from everything Black too, I would say, for sure.

Maurice Cherry:
Do you have a dream project that you’d love to do one day?

Matese Fields:
Yeah. So I think in the future, I want to do more things. More physical and more designing spaces. That’s kind of where I see my career going. So I would love to do an exhibit at a museum. I think that would be awesome. Somewhere where I could do digital design, but also design the space and the physical aspects around it too.

I’ve always had a weird affinity for doing a large wayfinding project. It sounds boring when you say it. But I think there’s something beautiful in directions, and telling people where to go, and helping people find their way. So sounds weird, but definitely something like that too. That would be really cool.

Maurice Cherry:
That doesn’t sound weird. I mean, our icon is a wayfinding sign. So it doesn’t sound weird at all.

Matese Fields:
For sure.

Maurice Cherry:
Where do you see yourself in the next five years? What kind of work do you want to be doing?

Matese Fields:
This is what I think about every day now, I feel like. So part of the reason 2022 was a really rough year is because I felt I had lost myself a little bit. I didn’t really know.

I guess I put a lot of purpose of my life into my work. So when I got laid off from my job, I was kind of like, “What do I do now?” For a while I was like, “Maybe I shouldn’t do design.” I felt like I was just there. There was nothing really pushing me. 2022 was a big year of self-reflection, and what I really want to do. And when I finally took the leap and was like, “Okay, I’m going to be independent. We’re going to make this work.” I think that’s when this, “What is the future going to be?” Became a little bit more real.

In the future, I see myself doing less design actually. I think the goal is to make design a part-time type of thing, where I can be really specific about projects I want to take on, and just really specific about what I do, and how I do it, and what I want to do.

And then the other half of that being, I have this vision of making a space. And with that, I haven’t thought of a name. I haven’t thought of any of that. But combined with my love of people, I just love being around people. I love helping people. I love bringing people together. So there’s a love for that. There’s a love for collecting and having things. I do have a lot of things, but everything kind of has a story behind it of why I love it, and why it’s in my collection. So there’s the love for people. There’s a love for things. And then there’s also a love for education.

And so I didn’t do well in college, and I think it was just because I didn’t have meaning behind why I was in school. I was just there, because I felt like it was something I should do, and I was making my parents proud and stuff like that.

But there’s non-traditional ways to learn what you want to do and who you want to be. And specifically in design, I think I was saying before we got on, us as Black people aren’t really taught that you can be successful in the arts, or in design, even in music, unless you’re a huge artist. So I think part of that is me teaching Black people that you can make money doing whatever you want, and you can specifically make money, be successful, be fulfilled in design.

So with all that said, I would love to create a space that could one part be my studio, where I’m doing that part-time design work, and then the other half being a maker space/art gallery/vintage shop/gathering space. And then it’d all be centered around blackness, and education, and storytelling, and community. It is a lot, but that’s sort of where my head is at currently.

Maurice Cherry:
I mean, I think that’s super aspirational to make a center for all that positive blackness. I don’t know how it would go in Portland, but I think it’s a good idea. I think it’s a good idea to have something like that.

Matese Fields:
I’ve had the same thought. At first I was like, “I need to move back to Detroit to do this.” And I think Detroit would be a great city for something to happen. I was kind of having these ideas when I was in Detroit. But I’ve been talking to a lot of people in Portland. I think it would actually be something that would be positive for the Black culture in Portland. It’s very white here. Everyone knows it. And when I first moved here, I was very thrown back. And even to me as someone who was the only Black person in my high school, I was like, “What is happening?” And I remember talking to people and being like, “I don’t know if I’m loving it here. I just moved from the Blackest city in America to here.” Everyone I was talking to, they were like, “Well, if you move, then it is going to continue being the whitest city.” So it’s like I think there’s a need for that space to be in Portland.

I think Portland’s a great city. They embrace art, and they embrace design and community. But you go to all these different spaces, and the same person is everything looks the same. The people who own it are the same. That’s not a slight to anyone, but the music is the same. And so I think it’s something that could definitely be beneficial for Portland. We’ll see. I’m pretty nomadic though. I like to move around, so I’m like…

Maurice Cherry:
I mean look, another city something like that could do really good in, Atlanta.

Matese Fields:
I need to go to Atlanta more honestly. When I first kind of started my career, the first year of my career was also freelancing. And I was doing a project for a company in Atlanta called Liaison Technologies, and they’re based in Alpharetta. So I would go to Atlanta every so often, but I haven’t been since probably 2016. So yeah, I would love to go back, for sure.

Maurice Cherry:
Okay. Well just to kind of wrap things up here, where can our audience find more information about you, about your work and everything? Where can they find that online?

Matese Fields:
Yeah. The best place would probably be my Instagram. It’s @tesecreates. T-E-S-E creates. There, you can find the link to my portfolio. And I post most of my design stuff on there. My website’s a little bit of a mess right now, but that’s also tesecreates.com. So yeah, those would probably be the two best ways.

Maurice Cherry:
All right. Sounds good. Well, Matese Fields, I want to thank you so much for coming on the show. I think the one thing that I got from your story that I think people listening should take with them is that it’s okay to try a lot of different things. I mean, design is a very vast field. It’s okay to try different things until you find what it is that works for you.

I mean, when I got into design 20 something years ago, there weren’t that many paths that you could go. And now, I think even with all the different places you can go, people still just funnel into, “I’m only going to do UX. I’m only going to do product.” And there’s so much more out there. And I think what your story really illustrates is that it’s possible to make a living as a designer, and that you just have to try different things until you find what it is that works for you. Which it sounds like you definitely have made happen. So thank you so much for coming on the show. I appreciate it.

Matese Fields:
Yeah, thank you. Thank you for having me. It’s been great chatting with you for sure.

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2020 has been a year full of difficult changes for a lot of people, but Darold Pinnock has managed to navigate this difficult time pretty well! Aside from his work as a brand designer for Georgia-based agency M&R Marketing, he’s also interviewed creatives and artists from all over the world through his podcast Passion Behind The Art.

We talked about the changes and challenges with working in person in the office during COVID-19, and he shared how his love of architecture led him into creating his own studio, as well as how starting his podcast helped him get clients. Darold also discussed how his faith and family help motivate him, spoke about growing up in Jamaica, and gave some great advice on how we can all help build a more equitable future. Take these words of wisdom from Darold and go after your dreams!

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Scissor is a small but fruitful graphic design studio based in Ojai, California. We love our work, we sweat the details, and we like to think it shows. Check out their work at studioscissor.com.

Jailyn Easley

For Jailyn Easley, combining design and technology with her work is like second nature. As a member of Accenture’s experience design team, Jailyn uses her phenomenal design skills with cutting edge tech like machine learning and mixed reality to create next-level work. But her journey as a designer doesn’t stop there!

We began our conversation talking about Jailyn’s brand design work with the popular Atlanta restaurant Slutty Vegan, and she shared how growing up in Baltimore and working with and being taught by luminary Black designers Leon Lawrence III and Jennifer White-Johnson helped hone her design skills and put her on a path to continuing her studies in Atlanta. We also spoke on Atlanta’s growing status as a creative hub, and she shed some light on her latest project titled 100 Days of Design. You’ll definitely want to keep an eye out for Jailyn — her star is on the rise!

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Transcript

Full Transcript

Maurice Cherry:
All right, so tell us who you and what you do.

Jailyn Easley:
My name is Jailyn Easley and I am a Baltimore race creative now currently living and working here in Atlanta. I specialize in design strategy and interactive designs, so I like to do a lot of things that are dealing with just different design trends and things that are going on currently as well as emerging technologies that some people may have heard of such as MR, Mixed Reality or VR, certain things like that. And I like combining the two worlds to see the different possibilities or opportunities that we’re able to reach.

Maurice Cherry:
Nice. And now you just recently started at Accenture, is that right?

Jailyn Easley:
Yes, back in October, yep.

Maurice Cherry:
Okay. What’s an average day like for you there?

Maurice Cherry:
So at Accenture I work in our innovation hub, which is the largest office in the Southeast region. I currently do experience design, so I help support our internal teams and whenever we have different clients that come in that want some sort of consulting workup done, we help support those pods that do mainly more of the strategy and business side of things. So they’re the ones helping close the deals and everything while we’re on the back end doing all the visual assets.

Maurice Cherry:
If a different client comes in, then we would make all types of assets, everything from digital signage to say welcome to that company name badges. We would do PowerPoint decks and we kind of come up with the theme around what the visual looks like for when that company comes in to do that workshop. So it’s a pretty interesting time. I get to learn a lot of different technologies and softwares and things like that. For example, I’m working in [inaudible 00:04:45] right now, which is kind of interesting because I never thought I would be actually doing real motion design stuff. So it’s pretty … It definitely pushes the limits when it comes to combining technology and design.

Maurice Cherry:
Nice. It sounds like it’s pretty fun so far.

Jailyn Easley:
Yeah, it’s awesome. I love Accenture. There’s so much to offer there.

Maurice Cherry:
I would imagine working in some place called like the innovation hub, that sounds very next level futuristic kind of stuff.

Jailyn Easley:
Yeah, we definitely, there’s so many things that Accenture is working on in house and just their dealings with other companies and things like that. We get a chance to put our hands in every little pot. So for example, we have a 360 camera that we’re testing out right now to see how we can use it within some of the workshops and helping to get that innovation piece, I guess, to the clients or communicated well to the clients so that they can see that part of Accenture as well.

Maurice Cherry:
What drew you to working for Accenture?

Jailyn Easley:
I think just the way that their company is progressing. They’re definitely not a brand new company, but a lot of the things that they’re doing in the market, they’re definitely dominating and being able to push the limits when it comes to thinking outside the box honestly. Because so many different problems to solve that we’ve done on the job and it’s just like whatever the client comes in for, we always find a really interesting way to problem solve around it. Honestly, coming out of SCAD, something that I wanted to do was being able to combine strategy and design. I liked the concept thing around designing and coming up with the theme and the abstract for it and everything like that. So I really was kind of drawn to that strategy and that consulting so to speak side of Accenture, so that’s definitely something that drew me forward to them.

Maurice Cherry:
And now for those that are listening and may not know specifically what experience design is or why you would combine strategy, which is something that’s probably more left brain cerebral with design, which is more right brain and creative, can you talk a little bit about that?

Jailyn Easley:
Accenture has a few different necks when it comes to their overall brand. So they have an Accenture strategy, they have an Accenture interactive, but I think the interesting part about that is that they co-create in one space. So definitely the importance to that, we’re being able to come up with different and innovative new looks on something that could have been easily solved with one, two, three. A lot of times that strategy involves using some sort of new technology, whether it’s a software or whether it’s an actual physical item. We use these things on a day to day basis, like artificial intelligence for example. We use it when we unlock our iPhones during the day or when we’re logging into our computers, but it’s never seen to solve a problem but more so just be a whistle and bell.

Jailyn Easley:
I guess just trying to incorporate that into day to day life is going to start to make it easier for, I guess for all users. An experienced design is something that some people might see as when they think of experience design, they think of user experience which in a lot of cases is UX and UI so to speak in industry term, that’s doing a lot of wire framing and looking at apps and the development or more so the design of the development. So you’re doing a lot of sketching, you’re doing a lot of prototyping and things of that nature. But in this sense, experience design is being able to create an experience for ideation for co-creation to happen. Because that’s ultimately what’s going to help take our clients to the next level is being able to co-create one room and come up with a solid solution that has to deal with pushing the limits as well as sticking to what the company’s core values are.

Maurice Cherry:
Now before Accenture you were doing art direction and doing brand design for a very popular local restaurant here in Atlanta. Talk to me a little bit about that.

Jailyn Easley:
Yeah, so before I came to Accenture I was working with Slutty Vegan. A lot of people know them as like the hot vegan burger joint and it’s definitely quite the experience having worked with such an amazing team like that. Back in I guess November of 2018 their team had a social media challenge which was package designing. Of course people knowing that I’m a foodie and I had been telling people, “Hey you guys should eat at Slutty Vegan. The line is super long but you guys should eat there,” to people sending me these different or the post from the package design challenge. So I ultimately ended up entering and I was like, “Okay, There’s some other designs out there and it should be interesting to see if I even make it to the next round.”

Jailyn Easley:
But then a few days later I get a notification that, “Hey, you made it to the top 10,” so of course people are voting on line. And I’m every day searching through the comments and even Jermaine Dupri voted on mine, which was kind of crazy and ultimately ended up winning the design challenge in which they paid me for the design. But then they also made me their personal freelancer. So all of their design needs were I guess driven towards me. And then with that, them having posted me on their social media, I also got all of these different freelance clients and I mean I was working on like 10 clients a month at one point and it was just crazy. So then once I was like, “Okay, freelancing was nice and everything,” but I think I was ready to make that full time commitment with Slutty Vegan as they were with me.

Jailyn Easley:
So probably around May of 2019 they hired me on full time and so I was able to create so many different types of designs for them. Everything from the bags in their restaurants to the fry cups. They just came out with the new Slut Sauce in stores near you soon and a few different other items that have reached a lot of people ultimately. And something that was also interesting, Pinky originally told me, she said, “I want you to put your name on the design.”

Jailyn Easley:
I was like, “Wait, you want me to put my actual name on the back?” Like, “Yes. Put it on there.” So I ended up putting it on there. She uses these bags every day now. So I have different people following me and out to me every day just because of something that I did almost or I guess almost like a year and a half ago now. It’s definitely been a great experience and I still work with them to this day, just on a freelance base. But definitely something that I recommend for any designer that wants to push their limits. Working with local businesses is a great idea.

Speaker 2:
Wow, that’s a pretty awesome story.

Jailyn Easley:
Thank you.

Speaker 2:
I mean you want a design contest, ended up working with them and they even, of course, I mean trust your work enough to want to work with you, but then to also say put your name on design. Like you never hear companies try to put that much investment into their design in that way or to their designers. That’s really good.

Jailyn Easley:
Exactly. And you know, the really cool thing about Pinky was that anybody that she hired on, she had known already that they were I guess contractors so to speak, so they still had their own businesses but Slutty Vegan was one of their clients. So she always put it as, “This is going to be that company that helps you step forward into whatever you’re looking to do.” So I definitely thank her for supporting my designs and being able to … I mean like I said I branded so many different things that, some that I can’t mention because they haven’t rolled out yet, but others that reached so many people, it was definitely a really good opportunity.

Maurice Cherry:
Nice. I have yet to make it to Slutty Vegan. I keep hearing about the lines and that puts me off because I don’t want to go and have to wait an hour in line. I don’t even know if there’s a good time to go. I’m assuming it’s still super popular where people are waiting in those long lines. Right?

Jailyn Easley:
Yeah. I mean literally you’re with everybody else in Atlanta. They’re like, “I would love to go to Slutty Vegan, but the lines are always terrible.” Okay. So here’s a cheat. So I would say go on a Tuesday or Wednesday afternoon are usually the best time. So that 4:00 to 7:00 period because there’s usually no line there.

Maurice Cherry:
Good to know. Good to know. I’m going to have to edit that out but no. So at the top of the show you mentioned being from Baltimore. Tell me about growing up there.

Jailyn Easley:
Yeah, so I am born and raised Baltimore. Family is from there. Went to an all girls high school, the oldest all girls public high school in the nation, Western High, as did all of the women in my family. So it was a traditional thing. So my high school was originally where I started doing design and I had taken a few AP art courses, which were pretty much just graphic arts instead of visual arts. So there I started playing in Photoshop and seeing what the different effects would do and I was able to get a few portfolio pieces out of that to insert when I went to Bowie State. So from high school, Baltimore was a really interesting place to grow up because when you’re younger you never really reach out. As an adult you might go to D.C. from Baltimore just because it’s an hour away but you’re never in D.C. unless it’s a field trip or something like that. So it was pretty interesting being so close to another really popular city but never really interacting with them I guess.

Jailyn Easley:
And so I went to university, I went to undergrad at Bowie State University, an HBCU out in Laurel, Maryland. And so there, I actually met one of my design mentors and one of your previous interviewees, Jennifer White Johnson. She was my professor at Bowie. So she was really influential in my life and still is. She is an amazing visual artist. She is definitely a master of all tricks. I mean every time I see something different on her Instagram, I’m like, “Oh my goodness, you’re doing this now.” She’s amazing. And she definitely helped me get through those college years of designing and just being able to articulate yourself as a designer of color and getting out what you’re really wanting to express. So that was pretty interesting. And she also definitely pushed me to go to SCAD during my, I guess senior year towards the end of Bowie. So she encouraged that move and when I moved down to Atlanta, I definitely kept in touch with her as well. Just sending her stuff and keeping up on what she was doing definitely inspired me to keep going as a creative. So yeah.

Maurice Cherry:
So talk to me a little bit about just what it was like in that sort of Bowie State learning environment. You’re right, we did have Jennifer, she was on the show I think two or three months ago, a few months ago. But I’m curious because I’ve heard a lot about Bowie State and I’ve certainly heard a lot about the program through Jennifer, through other teachers that are there. From your perspective as a student, what was it like?

Jailyn Easley:
Yeah, so originally I honestly did not want to go to Bowie. I didn’t want to be in the state of Maryland. But you know when you have tuition and stuff it kind of limits you. So I ended up going to Bowie. A friend of my dad’s, which was another one of my professors, he showed us during my last year of high school, showed us around that building, which is the VCBMA, Visual Communications and Digital Media Arts building. So they had everything from theater to design and they had all these nice computer labs and it just set the tone for me to say, “Okay, if I really wanted to be in an environment where I’m able to flourish and also work amongst other designers that are my age and also that look like me then this would be where I would want to do it.”

Jailyn Easley:
So especially at an HBCU, I knew that that was something that I wanted to do straight out of high school was that I wanted to be around my people. So I went to Bowie and my years there were pretty awesome just with my … I guess there I was Campus Activities [inaudible 00:18:14] Vice President there and I was on a lot of the initiatives under VCBMA, so different art clubs and things like that. And also, I would work to get sent to different conferences. So throughout my time at Bowie, I think they helped me go to two different conferences. One was HBCU South by Southwest, which is [inaudible 00:18:37] by a startup called Opportunity Hub that’s local here to Atlanta actually. Also a computer graphics conference called SIGGRAPH, which is over in LA. And they have it in a few different other places.

Jailyn Easley:
So it opened the door for me to say, “Whatever you want to do, you have that ability to do it, so why wait?” Something that I was passionate about, this was something that had allies in I guess. Because sometimes when you don’t have friends that do the same things that you do or they don’t really understand your thought process and lot of things, then you get a little discouraged or unmotivated in some ways. So good to have a support system around me that cared about my growth and I also cared about theirs. And I’ll say that also about the professors. Many of them were supportive and one of them helped me get my first internship with another one of your interviewees, Leon Lawrence. I actually worked with him. That was my first design internship during my senior year. I commuted back and forth for a whole semester from Bowie to D.C. every two days or so. And I went to go work at NACo, the National Association of Counties, over in D.C. near the Hill. So that also was another step-

Jailyn Easley:
[inaudible 00:20:00] that also was another step in my education, I guess, that kind of opened my eyes to say, “Okay, there’s not just design for aesthetic or design for whatever. There’s designed for political things too.” That was something that I hadn’t even thought about. It was really interesting the way that he kind of ran his team as well. It got me exposed to a lot of different types of methodologies and just ways of doing certain things. Also, I ended up learning some different softwares there as well. But overall, being in college at Bowie you have the HBCU life mixed with the design life mixed with just being a part of the campus, so to speak.

Jailyn Easley:
Again, I was Campus Activities Vice President, so we kind of helped throw homecoming and spring fling and all those different events. I guess on top of that, I also helped design for those things too. I was designing all of the homecoming posters and all of the posters for different activities going on at school and any events and stuff like that. So that also kind of gave me the experience that I needed when I started venturing out to do more freelance work. So it was like, “Okay, I have something to build off of now.” It was definitely a really huge experience from me there.

Maurice Cherry:
Wow. Shout out to Bowie state and there. One, I’ve heard a lot about how great the program is, but hearing you talk about it from the student end to see just how encompassing it was, not just to you as a designer, but also to you as a black person because you’re also working in these design environments with other black people. So you’re able to see kind of, “Oh, this is what the possibility can be for someone who looks like me.” You know what I mean?

Jailyn Easley:
Yeah, absolutely.

Maurice Cherry:
Wow. When you first got down here to Atlanta, what was your first design job? I feel like there’s a story there.

Jailyn Easley:
I signed up with a recruiting agency, which was the Creative Group and usually they have different clients and they’ll place you at these different places if fit the criteria or whatever have you. So I ended up interviewing with them. They didn’t have anything at the time, but I was interested in just being able to help, I guess other creatives get different design jobs and just being able to help also other creatives of color get design jobs because I felt like that was something that I had had a little bit of experience in on the design in, as well as on the the mentoring end, so to speak. So I ended up getting that job, which was just being a recruiter for different companies and things like that. So if, let’s say if Home Depot needed a website designer, we would help find them and place them there. That was really my first introduction to the business of design, so to speak.

Jailyn Easley:
I got to learn a lot about what design agencies function like on the internal scale. So being able to know what a creative director was, what an art director was, what they did, what kind of projects they worked on, and more so for me, help me progress, what are they looking for in resumes? What’s the price point for those? How do I get the most out of what I’m doing now? So that kind of helped me or so to speak, pushed me to be able to start to venture out to these different companies and say, “Hey, I want to start applying for certain places so that I feel like I have kind of a wealth of knowledge to be able to compare.” I wanted to start to apply for jobs at that point.

Jailyn Easley:
I think my first job here as a designer was more so freelance. So I was doing a lot of freelance for clients around the area because Atlanta is a really big place for entrepreneurs and everybody owns their own business here. Everybody has a store. They have social media presence, so everyone needs a logo done or some branding or some packaging for a new product they’re coming out with. A lot of my time was dedicated to helping other people kind of progress the branding of their business and sitting down with them and kind of looking over exactly what they needed to help, I guess progress with whatever visual assets they were trying to produce. Whether that be an apparel line or a candle line or a music label, whatever have you.

Jailyn Easley:
Then my, I guess Slutty Vegan was technically black my in-between job because it was still a startup environment, but I didn’t really have a design team there to support me and kind of balance with me. So I guess Accenture was my first real design job, so to speak, where I have some say in the creative decisions where I’m able to kind of produce what I want and have voice, so I can help support these different workshops and helping to gain the clients and things like that. Yeah, [inaudible 00:25:28] was definitely, I guess my first real industry job, so to speak.

Maurice Cherry:
That’s really good that when you started out here, it was in a capacity where you could really kind of see what companies were looking for in terms of hiring because… So I’ve been here now in Atlanta for 20 years now and I’ll tell people, like designers that want to come here or designers that are interested, I’m like, “Atlanta is great for freelancers, but it’s terrible if you’re looking for work,” because like you said, there are so many people that are doing something. I can’t tell you how many times I’ve taken an Uber or Lyft somewhere and I happened to mention I’m a designer. All of a sudden, “Oh, let me get your card because I’m looking for somebody. I need a logo for this.” If I was still freelancing, I could be getting work left and right, but then I’ll have people that will contact me. They’re like, “Oh, I’m moving from New York or San Francisco and I want to know what product design jobs are down here.” And I’m like, “I don’t know.”

Maurice Cherry:
Also, the Atlanta, and I feel like maybe this is starting to change, but I still feel like the Atlanta business landscape doesn’t really respect designers, at least not in the same way as say New York or Silicon Valley when as it relates to kind of the competitiveness and the types of jobs and the amount of jobs that are available. Atlanta still feels like it’s a little behind in that respect. I’m curious when you were doing the recruiting, what is it that companies are looking for outside of what’s on the resume?

Jailyn Easley:
Yeah. Atlanta, like you kind of said, it’s definitely a pretty big, I guess business park so to speak. I say that in the way of there are a lot of companies starting to move here on Georgia grounds just to get a little bit of the tech scene here because outside of Silicon Valley, Atlanta is definitely starting to be a hub of innovation that’s growing. There’s so many different startups and other technologies here that companies are wanting to move here. So these companies are primarily looking for… A lot of them like… Okay, and I’ll say this too. There are certain companies that like people that are fresh out, people that are going to schools like General Assembly, which you could do UX and UI and graphic design, that some people that are coming out of Georgia State or local colleges like SCAD too. But then there are some companies that want people that are seasoned professionals, so they want the people that have maybe freelanced for Cartoon Network and ESPN and all these other places because they understand and they can kind of bring something to the table.

Jailyn Easley:
So I’ll say a place like the Home Depot, they have a huge hub here in Atlanta, but they definitely like to hire on a lot of the new talent because that’s what kind of keeps their designs fresh and that’s what kind of keeps their, I guess everything moving for them is they’re getting those people that are fresh out and they know the industry, they know what trends are going on. So they like that. It definitely just depends on your tenure and where you want to go. But in addition, they’re looking for people with obviously, their own full websites that are interactive, that look really good. They’re looking for people whose resumes are super on point as far as layout and simplicity goes, a really big trend, and this is nothing new to you or anyone in the industry is minimalism.

Jailyn Easley:
So everyone likes to see something clean because honestly, maybe half the time, when the people that are hiring these designers aren’t designers themselves. The person that hired me at Accenture isn’t a designer in any way, shape or form. So it’s pretty interesting. You would be surprised to know that a lot of these companies are having a design manager who may not have anything hands-on to do with the design that’s hiring this person; definitely just to keep the perspective fresh in terms of what you’re putting out their stuff. Those are just a few things, but if you go to any of these recruiting agencies, they’ll kind of tell you what the client is looking for in that particular instance just so you’re getting the best out of that situation.

Maurice Cherry:
Interesting. I had the roughest time with design back when I was really looking before I started… Well, not really before I started my studio, even when I was winding my studio down, it was tough. I remember going to one, and I’ll name names because I don’t care, but I went to not the Creative Circus, I think it’s the Creative Circle or something. They all have, “creative,” in their name in some [crosstalk 00:30:21] or whatever. But this was like the Creative Circle and I remember going and I had my resume and I had shown that I had my own studio here called, “Lunch.” This was at the time, I think we had just passed the eight year mark and I was like, “Yeah, I’ve done my own studio work for eight years. But then before that, I worked at Web MD, AT&T and whatever.”

Maurice Cherry:
I remember the recruiter looking at my resume and she’s like, “Uh-huh (affirmative),” and then she put like a big X over my freelance experience on my resume and said, “So it looks like you stopped working in 2008. What’s that about?” And I’m like, “Wait, what? Do you not see the 2008 to 2017 part here where I clearly have been working and I’ve won awards and here are the awards and everything?” She’s like, “Yeah, none of that really matters. We’re looking for people to have actual employment experience because we have to be able to check references and make sure that you’ve actually done the work and not just sat at home and said that you’ve done the work.” And I was like, “Well damn, okay. That’s rough,” but the reason I’m asking that is because I know like we said, there’s a lot of people here that do freelance work I’m basing it off my experience, I can’t really talk to others, but it seems like that freelance experience often doesn’t count sometimes.

Jailyn Easley:
Yeah. Sometimes in some instances it doesn’t for when you’re trying to get into those Fortune 500 companies. They want to see what, “real work,” you’ve done so to speak, and I say that quote unquote because they can see the you did this and that for this football team or the NFL. They want to see these big, large names that kind of strike some sort of excitement within them because if you’re doing anything on a smaller scale, they call it mom and pop shop stuff. So it all depends on the job that they’re looking for.

Jailyn Easley:
But I’ll say when I was working with the Creative Group, we looked for all levels of people, people that were still in school and there was some people who were like, okay, we really wanted them for a particular job, but they were still in school and they didn’t have any real work experience. But then there were some people with 15 years plus work experience that we were like, “Okay, this person looks good because they’ve had this experience with A, B and C.” Definitely just depends on the scenario there, but I would say choose wisely and don’t put all your eggs in one basket because like you, I obviously didn’t have that well of luck with recruiting agencies because I ended up working for one.

Maurice Cherry:
That makes sense. I feel like the Atlanta ecosystem is very unique in that we have these top art schools like SCAD and Art Institute.q We have even really great programs at four year institutions like Georgia State, Georgia Tech, Emory, et cetera, but then we’ve also got all these HBCUs here. So you have this really interesting mix of talent from a lot of different points of view, a lot of different backgrounds, all different types of experience. It just seems like the Atlanta market has not necessarily found the best way to really tap into that. I still get conversations from people like, “Oh, we can’t find diverse candidates for our hiring pool.” In Atlanta? You mean to tell me in Atlanta, you can’t find a black designer? I refuse to believe that, but whatever.

Jailyn Easley:
I was going to say something that, going back to Accenture, that I really admire about them is they not only promote diversity and inclusion, but they are one of those companies that shows it. I always kind of joke with one of my other senior managers and she’s like, “This is as many black people as you’re going to see in one environment at one time, so definitely soak this up.” I’m like, wow. It’s a huge mixing pot when it comes to so many different backgrounds and where people are from. I’ve met people from all different places all over because it [inaudible 00:34:37] all these different offices. It’s something that I’m happy to be a part of and I’m glad that they’re actually promoting that when they’re recruiting from these different universities and stuff like that.

Maurice Cherry:
At your current stage right now, you first of all, congratulations. You recently graduated from SCAD, so congratulations on that.

Jailyn Easley:
Thank you.

Maurice Cherry:
Between that and the work that you’re doing at Accenture, how do you see the current design scene or the current design community in Atlanta?

Jailyn Easley:
I would say that the creative community here in Atlanta is diverse, not only in capabilities. There’s so many different types of design and creative, so to speak here; everything from set design to creative direction to brand design, but also, actually in I guess, physical appearance there are different types. I knew that going to SCAD it wasn’t going to be an HBCU or a PWI necessarily, but I was interested to see what that experience would be like. Surprisingly when I got there, we were probably still the minority, but there were a lot of different kinds of people there. There were Nigerians, there were Asian people, there were people from Columbia and Brazil and it was just a huge opportunity to be able to gain those different perspectives and just about what other people are thinking about and what other people are doing in their design. I still have really good design friends that are from all different backgrounds that kind of offer their own I guess, pizzazz, so to speak, to design. They definitely are able to articulate themselves in a whole different way than maybe you or me do.

Jailyn Easley:
It’s really interesting to see that scene of people coming into the corporate world and of course, you want to keep up with different classmates and things like that. So they’re working at different agencies that deal with different ad agencies or they’re working on freelance or they’re working in the corporate space. It’s definitely becoming more of a… I guess corporate is starting to catch up to where the younger designers are just in terms of different trends that you kind of see going on in design right now and just through what their product is or what they’re advertising, what their ad looks like when it’s put out. So that combination of designers and environment is really starting to I guess, make Atlanta so to speak. Whenever anyone asks me, “How’s Atlanta,” or, “What are you doing down there?” Or, “How’s the creative scene?” It’s always something different going on. There’s always sort of installation going on or pop up or vendor market or even conferences. There are so many different meetups here.

Jailyn Easley:
Having worked for the Creative Group, one of my recruiting tools, so to speak, was meetup.com. So we would find events that had to deal with design and we would go to them to find people that we wanted to kind of recruit for the Creative Group. We would go to different events just that were being held based in UX design or based in development or there were all different kinds of designs. There were study groups, there were just having fun kind of game night design types of things. It’s definitely a really interesting combination of people versus environment.

Maurice Cherry:
Nice. So one of the projects we’re working on right now is called, “The 100 Days of Design.” Where did the idea come from for that?

Jailyn Easley:
I had just been kind of looking to doing a different medium of design. I had been doing your black and white graphic design, so to speak, which was using Photoshop and different Adobe tools to help with the designs. But I wanted to start illustrative style just because it was something that I had seen but I had never tried. Honestly, I was a little afraid or intimidated because I had seen so many different renditions and interpretations of different artists doing their own illustration.

Jailyn Easley:
So I started doing, “100 Days of Design,” and I looked for a challenge actually, to do, but I couldn’t find anything. I think there was one, but it started in April and I was like, “Well, I want to get started now.” So I made up my own challenge and it’s probably some other designers have probably done it, but I just called it, “100 Days of Design.” So each day, I am pushing myself to not only create one thing each day, but also share it because something that I had seen in the past just with my own work, was that, especially a lot on my social media with Instagram and Facebook and things like that, was that I hadn’t put too much of my work on there. I wanted to get into the habit of being able to share my work with others, not because I wanted them… Well, I guess not because I want to promote myself, but just because I wanted to get my art…

Jailyn Easley:
Not because I wanted promote myself, but just because I wanted to get my art out there into the world and you know, not just have it on my website or because I was actually talking to a friend and he was like, “You should start to put your stuff somewhere else other than your website.” And I’m like, “Well, why? Like why does it matter?” He’s like, “It’s a way of expression.” Because he’s a photographer. So, if you’d look at his Instagram, it’s all his work as opposed to just pictures of him and random stuff. So, it’s just a way for me to be able to push myself to create every day, to keep going, to be able to route to different opportunities with my design and see where I can push the limits personally. So.

Maurice Cherry:
Nice. How’s it been going so far?

Jailyn Easley:
It’s good. I am not the best when it comes to time management. So, I’m still definitely trying to figure out a good schedule because with me working full-time plus I do yoga after work and still kind of studying it and I got my certification in yoga last February. So, still kind of studying it whenever I have the time to and doing design and it’s like I wanted to be able to, I guess, find some time for myself to do something that I like to do while not sweating all day and working hard diligently all day.

Jailyn Easley:
So, besides that part of it, I think it’s going pretty well and I’m starting to explore the different types of illustrations I can do and different ways that I can start to incorporate different things like color palettes and themes and things like that. So, it’s gone pretty well.

Maurice Cherry:
Well the good thing is you don’t necessarily have to do it every day. So, like a hundred days, there’s 360, well, this year there’s 366 days. So, you can get a hundred days out of that, doesn’t have to necessarily be consecutive.

Jailyn Easley:
Right. I’ve been like some days I’ll group them together. Like this past weekend I just grouped Friday through Sunday together. I was like yeah, here’s all of the weekend stuff.

Maurice Cherry:
I mean that’s kind of what you have to do, especially when you’re working full-time and you’ve got other stuff going on. I did a project back in 2015 called the Year of Tea. It was a podcast and I would do a different episode, like a short episode, like less than five minutes reviewing a different type of tea or a different brand of tea or whatever. And I didn’t do those every day. I would batch them, especially if I knew I was going to be off at a conference for a week or off somewhere else, I would just batch them so they would schedule to go out. Now I kind of shot myself in the foot a little bit because I said like a year. So, I had to do it every day. A friend of mine, Diane Holton, who has been on the show, she’s a deputy art director at AARP in D.C. And she did a whole thing also on Instagram, a whole like daily-ish design practice called Daily Digits where she fashioned numbers out of different found objects. So, like she would get-

Jailyn Easley:
I think I saw that.

Maurice Cherry:
… like little candies and make the number eight or something like that, you know? Oh, you heard of it?

Jailyn Easley:
I think I saw it because I had followed Diane at one point. With the whole D.C. And Bowie thing, they always brought someone new from the creative D.C. space to Bowie, so I think I had met her.

Maurice Cherry:
Yeah, she did the campaign, well that wasn’t a campaign. I know she did end up doing a campaign with HP on the whole like thousand, she did a thousand of them for Daily Digits. So, it was just interesting seeing how she would take these random objects and just make numbers. Like I’m looking at it right now. One of them, she took Kit-Kat wrappers and made 997 and then she used ramen noodles and flavor packets to make 998. Used gummy worms to make 999 so it’s interesting how you see all these different objects and figure like, oh, what’s a way to create something out of this? You know, that’s a really good thing. I wish more creatives did that just as a practice, not necessarily to have like a body of something to show off, but it does kind of, it engages that sense of discovery and creativity that sometimes can get lost if you’re just doing a nine to five or if you’re hustling as an entrepreneur, you kind of lose that spark a little bit unless something new comes along and then this forces you into that on a pretty regular basis, I think.

Jailyn Easley:
Yeah, absolutely. And, and I’ll say, going from the startup life with Slutty Vegan and it was kind of like a 24/7 thing because it was weekends, it was during the week, it was all the time. So, ultimately I was doing stuff for them, but I never was able to kind of get out my own creativity and be able to push myself to say, “Okay, let’s think of something new. Let’s create something new.” When I came over to Accenture, it was like, I’m still in this transition period and I had some other things in life going on, so I wanted this time to be able to start fresh this year. You know, not having made any resolutions, but more so just intentions of being able to help myself grow and help that self-discovery, like you were saying. That kind of made that internal spark from me because it was something that, when you haven’t done it for a while, it’s like you almost a little bit lose that motivation.

Jailyn Easley:
And that’s something that is what makes you, you, it’s something that encourages you do better. It encourages you to keep going and it encourages you to be this free being. So, it was something that I wanted to be able to still have and say, “Okay, this is something that I’m going to do for me.” I’m just more so sharing it just to get into the habit of sharing it. But this is definitely something that is all for me and not to, like you said, have a huge body of work, but just to have, to see my progression over my works and to see which ways I can do different things here and there. So.

Maurice Cherry:
Yeah. So, just to kind of switch gears here a little bit, what are you excited about at the moment?

Jailyn Easley:
Currently … Okay. Can I name two things?

Maurice Cherry:
Sure.

Jailyn Easley:
One is a quick thing, so I’m excited about South by Southwest this year. I want to go, and obviously Accenture being a huge company in innovation they’re always doing different events there. So, not only for them, but I went back in 2017 and it was, even without having a conference ticket, I mean we had one, but outside of the conference is where the installations were and the companies were doing these huge pop=ups and all different kinds of stuff. So, I would love to go back to South by Southwest this year. So, that’s my number one thing.

Jailyn Easley:
Number two. So, at my job right now at Accenture, we are trying to push our internal teams to start doing more things that are combining technology with design and more so, so that it makes sense to them combining technology with strategy, so to speak. Because when you’re talking to them, it’s more so just about the tactics behind things and how you’re going to do what you’re going to do to get there. But the what and the how that you’re going to get there in. We’re trying to make that aspect of it technology.

Jailyn Easley:
So, for example, we have an internal application that allows you to use this artificial intelligence and this augmented reality to be able to present these huge PowerPoint presentations just at the touch of your fingers, but certain things like that. Obviously, it sounds like a really extravagant idea, but things like that take time along with testing and just being able to figure out the kinks, figure out where it works, push its limitations, see how it engages with its audience and things like that.

Jailyn Easley:
So, certain things like that within our hub we are kind of testing just to see what, I guess, how we can advantage it the most. So, that’s definitely something that I’m excited about as well.

Maurice Cherry:
What’s something that perhaps not many people understand about you?

Jailyn Easley:
Oh, I would say a lot of people don’t understand my perspective. Having come from Baltimore within the inner city goes to school there and coming from there to Bowie to Atlanta and going to different places along the way. A lot of people don’t understand my thought process when it comes to how I’m thinking about things. And I guess the fluidity in which I’m thinking about certain things, I always like to get variety and get other people’s perspective and get just a round table view of what’s going on. Because I feel like before we do any problem solving or solution oriented tactics, we need to figure out what’s currently at the table and get it from each angle. So, I’m always the one to say, “Well, have we thought about this? Well, how did we get here if we haven’t gotten there?” Or I’m always the one to ask questions.

Jailyn Easley:
And to some people it may come off as, well, maybe I don’t want to use the word arrogant, but sometimes it may come off as like a know-it-all type of situation, but more so it’s just pushing people to be able to understand the different sides of one situation. Because outside of your view, there are the person that you’re talking to and the people that they’re talking to. So, always pushing people to see the different perspectives in life.

Maurice Cherry:
Who are some of the people that influence you?

Jailyn Easley:
Some of the people that influence me, I would say a lot of them are within the educational sector. Two of them which I went to Bowie with or which were my professors at Bowie, one is actually Jennifer White-Johnson. She definitely had a huge impact on my college life when it came to design and things like that. But also another one of my mentors at Bowie, Tamisha Ponder, she is my yoga mentor, so to speak. So, I have my design, I have my yoga. They definitely helped shape the person I became at Bowie from the different programs that I had joined with both of them in it, or the different events that I attended that they may have hosted or certain things like that had an influence on what I thought or what I made of the different topics that were brought up.

Jailyn Easley:
And just being able to get exposed to certain things like that, as opposed to just doing the college thing, going to class, going back to my room, being really interactive with things that were going on, not only on campus but outside of campus, what can you do? They would always push me to do things off campus because one of them did go to Bowie and the other, I think, Jennifer White-Johnson went to UMBC. So they were like, do things outside of here. Don’t just say here, venture out. So, that’s definitely something that impacted me throughout my college years.

Jailyn Easley:
And just now to this day, they both give me a really positive influence on life. And I would say one other person is a professor that I had at SCAD, Judy Salzinger. She is definitely a character. I love Judy so much. I remember one of the first things she said to me, she was like, “You know what Jailyn?” I say, “Yeah?” She said, “You’re a smart ass.” And I laughed. [inaudible 00:52:40].

Jailyn Easley:
I was like, okay, good. Yeah, Judy is amazing. She was also one of those people that helped me see the different views on things. She was a professor for a few of my classes at SCAD, but she’s also the chair of the department of advertising there. So, just through, she took us on different field trips and just from sitting and talking with her, she was an industry professional before, so she had some experience in the things that I wanted to do and the places that I wanted to go. So, her being kind of my on-site influence because she was here in Atlanta when I came down here. And then just having my two other mentors back home and keeping up with them still. So, it was kind of a nice, easy balance between the three of them and the impact that they kind of put on, not only my design life but life outside of design as well.

Maurice Cherry:
Nice. Where do you see yourself in the next five years? Like it’s 2025 what kinds of things do you want to be working on?

Jailyn Easley:
So, in 2025 I would love to, over the years just start to learn how to design in these different softwares that are dealing with virtual reality and augmented reality. Hopefully wouldn’t take a full five years but definitely would be looking into starting to utilize that in people’s day-to-day lives. These are things that some people think are just the bells and whistles on the car, but in reality these are the moving parts to it. And these are things that we can start to incorporate into what we’re doing on a day-to-day basis. So, I would love to just be able to kind of articulate that with a company that is that forward thinking and that open-minded, so to speak, to give that leverage towards me to be able to help promote these different technologies and help put them in a way that is not only solving a problem but also is, obviously visually pleasing. So.

Maurice Cherry:
Well, just to kind of wrap things up here, where can our audience find out more about you and about your work online?

Jailyn Easley:
So, you can go to my website, www.jailyneasley.com. J-A-I-L-Y-N E-A-S-L-E-Y. And you can find me on Instagram @finessewilliams, like finesse, F-I-N-E-S-S-E, finessewilliams_ _ on Instagram.

Maurice Cherry:
Nice. I like that for Finesse Williams. That’s dope. Well, Jailyn Easley, thank you so much for coming on the show. I think as I mentioned to this to you, when I reached out before I was like we’ve actually had crossed paths before. This is back when we were trying to do our whole student perspective series. I think you were still at Bowie at the time and I think to look at that and now especially as you’ve talked about your story coming down here to Atlanta, going to SCAD, working with these brands. It’s amazing how much you’ve been able to accomplish in really a fairly short amount of time and I think it’s great that you’ve had the support of other black designers and other really honestly black people in entrepreneurship and business to make that happen. And I feel like that’s something that we just need to see more of and I’m really excited to see what you do in the future.

Maurice Cherry:
Like as I was hearing you talk about this, you reminded me a lot of someone who we’ve actually had on the show three times now, Sarah Huny Young, who, she’s now … What does she want Sarah do now? She’s a DJ now, I think, but she’s been a pivotal part of design and stuff for like the past 15, 20 odd something years. There’s like three interviews over on the site so people can listen to it. But as I was listening to you describe all of these different experiences you’ve had and working with all these different brands, I was like, I can see just how grand your career is going to be. So, I’m glad to have the chance to talk to you at this stage of your career and see just how things are going. So, thank you so much for coming on the show. I appreciate it.

Jailyn Easley:
Yeah, well thank you for having me.


Submissions for Volume 2 of the design anthology RECOGNIZE open on March 1! For more information, visit recognize.design!

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It’s been a while since we first had Bobby C. Martin, Jr. on Revision Path, so I’m glad to have a chance to really sit down and talk with him to kick things off for our final month of interviews for 2018.

As the co-founder and founding partner of the Original Champions of Design, Bobby’s identity design system work sets him in a class all his own. Whether he’s handling rebranding for the WNBA or creating an identity system for the Girl Scouts, Bobby has helped elevate companies around the world.

We started off by talking about the business of OCD, including how it’s changed with the times, how they find clients, and what it’s like working with and building a team. From there, we took things back to Bobby’s early days in Virginia, and he shared the inspirations and memories which influenced him as a designer, and we also talked about design curriculum, as well as what it feels like for him to occupy space as such a well-known designer. Bobby wants everyone to know that you can make a living from being a designer, and putting everything you can into your work is the key to success!

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